1. Joined
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    17 May '11 14:203 edits
    Found this quote ostensibly taken from a Watchtower Society publication entitled "Life—How Did It Get Here? By Evolution or by Creation?":

    "We need to face the fact that the theory of evolution serves the purposes of Satan. He wants people to imitate his course, and that of Adam and Eve, in rebelling against God. This is especially so now, since the Devil has only “a short period of time” left. (Revelation 12:9-12) Thus,believing in evolution would mean promoting his interests and blinding oneself to the wonderful purposes of the Creator. How, then, should we feel about this? We feel indignant toward those who try to defraud us of money, or even of a few material possessions. We should feel even stronger indignation toward the doctrine of evolution and its originator, since the intent is to defraud us of eternal life.—1 Peter 5:8."


    Presumably any pro-evolution argument, no matter how well reasoned, will be viewed as the words of Satan intending to defraud the reader of eternal life.
    Can an individual who believes the above engage in a discussion based in reason? This would seem to help to explain the irrationality of some of the posters on this forum.

    Are there any non-JWs here who hold a similar postion? On what do you base your position?
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    17 May '11 14:30
    1 John 5:19 (New Living Translation)
    19 We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one.

    Why would this theory of evolution not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well.
  3. SubscriberProper Knob
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    17 May '11 14:32
    Originally posted by galveston75
    1 John 5:19 (New Living Translation)
    19 We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one.

    Why would this theory of evolution not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well.
    Because Satan doesn't exist, we're grown ups living in the real world.
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    17 May '11 14:383 edits
    Originally posted by galveston75
    1 John 5:19 (New Living Translation)
    19 We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one.

    Why would this theory of evolution not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well.
    Why would the Watchtower Society "not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well"?

    Do you consider everything that opposes the doctrine of the Watchtower Society to be a "tool of Satan"?
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    17 May '11 14:49
    Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
    Why would the Watchtower Society "not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well"?

    Do you consider everything that opposes the doctrine of the Watchtower Society to be a "tool of Satan"?
    Again:
    1 John 5:19 (New Living Translation)
    19 We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one.
  6. Joined
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    17 May '11 14:53
    Originally posted by galveston75
    Again:
    1 John 5:19 (New Living Translation)
    19 We know that we are children of God and that the world around us is under the control of the evil one.
    Instead of demanding that one infer your intended meaning, why don't you just plainly state it? Why hide it under a bushel?

    Once again:
    Why would the Watchtower Society "not be a tool Satan uses to control so many in the world? Seems to work on many millions petty well"?

    Do you consider everything that opposes the doctrine of the Watchtower Society to be a "tool of Satan"?
  7. SubscriberSuzianne
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    17 May '11 14:54
    Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
    Found this quote ostensibly taken from a Watchtower Society publication entitled "Life—How Did It Get Here? By Evolution or by Creation?".

    [quote]"[b]We need to face the fact that the theory of evolution serves the purposes of Satan.
    He wants people to imitate his course, and that of Adam and Eve, in rebelling against God. This is especially so now ...[text shortened]...

    Are there any non-JWs here who hold a similar postion? On what do you base your position?[/b]
    Just what the heck are you on about?

    "Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:"

    This is 1 Peter 5:8. I don't have a clue where you got what you purport to be 1 Peter 5:8.

    What tipped me to this is that I do not believe the "doctrine of evolution", nor evolution as a theory, is anywhere in the Bible. How could it be? On the Origin of Species wasn't published until 1859.
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    17 May '11 15:001 edit
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Just what the heck are you on about?

    "Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:"

    This is 1 Peter 5:8. I don't have a clue where you got what you purport to be 1 Peter 5:8.

    What tipped me to this is that I do not believe the "doctrine of evolution", nor evolution as a theo ...[text shortened]... the Bible. How could it be? On the Origin of Species wasn't published until 1859.
    Not sure what point you're trying to make, but I thought it pretty clear that the quote is "taken from a Watchtower Society publication entitled 'Life—How Did It Get Here? By Evolution or by Creation?'". I'm not purporting anything to be 1 Peter 5:8. Please reread the OP and reframe your post accordingly.
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    17 May '11 15:031 edit
    It seems to me a bit unfair. So this god guy creates us in satans image (in light of human behaviour under religious doctrine), and then expect us not to use our logical deduction abilities to escape that horror. That's just annoying is what that is.

    Another thing I don't like about god is how he didn't just use his powers to remove the knowledge after Adam & Eve took those bites. Nooooo, he has to kick them out of eden and make their descendants suffer for all eternity, even though he's the one who created that damn snake whose words he knew Adam & Eve couldn't resist, in the first place.

    He's a really bitter, lonely, sadistic puck, god is. Who could possibly take him seriously after all that?
  10. SubscriberSuzianne
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    17 May '11 15:14
    Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
    Not sure what point you're trying to make, but I thought it pretty clear that the quote is "taken from a Watchtower Society publication entitled 'Life—How Did It Get Here? By Evolution or by Creation?'". I'm not purporting anything to be 1 Peter 5:8. Please reread the OP and reframe your post accordingly.
    Well, see, I don't believe the quote came from some nebulous "Watchtower Society publication" then.

    Not even the Watchtower Society gets the words of the Bible THAT wrong. The only conclusion I can draw is that your "quote" is not entirely accurate.
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    17 May '11 15:24
    Originally posted by Zenarctic
    It seems to me a bit unfair. So this god guy creates us in satans image (in light of human behaviour under religious doctrine), and then expect us not to use our logical deduction abilities to escape that horror. That's just annoying is what that is.

    Another thing I don't like about god is how he didn't just use his powers to remove the knowledge after ...[text shortened]... tter, lonely, sadistic puck, god is. Who could possibly take him seriously after all that?
    Sounds like a different topic. Maybe you should start a thread on it. Meanwhile, if you have anything to say about the OP, please do.
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    17 May '11 15:31
    Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
    Sounds like a different topic. Maybe you should start a thread on it. Meanwhile, if you have anything to say about the OP, please do.
    Well, duh... if evolution serves satan it serves god just fine, from where I stand. He can't have it both ways, omnipotent as he may be: have us both think for ourselves and expect us not to. Frankly, if god exists, I doubt he's having a problem with evolution. After all, he would then be its' inventor (which is kind of not the most impressive work you could imagine from such a powerful entity - but still, not half bad). I'm sure the reason we can understand evolution is so that we will be all the more in awe of his skills. He's like: "Oh, yeah, and that was goooooood. Look folks, look what I did. I'm like the best god evva'!"
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    17 May '11 15:34
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Well, see, I don't believe the quote came from some nebulous "Watchtower Society publication" then.

    Not even the Watchtower Society gets the words of the Bible THAT wrong. The only conclusion I can draw is that your "quote" is not entirely accurate.
    Doesn't seem like you understand the reference to 1 Peter 5:8. I don't think it's supposed to be a quote, rather it seems that it was referenced in an attempt to support an underlying idea that "you must be vigilant against Satan". In this case the idea that "the theory of evolution serves the purposes of Satan, so you must be vigilant against it".

    Care to answer the questions at the end of the OP?
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    17 May '11 15:37
    Originally posted by Zenarctic
    Well, duh... if evolution serves satan it serves god just fine, from where I stand. He can't have it both ways, omnipotent as he may be: have us both think for ourselves and expect us not to. Frankly, if god exists, I doubt he's having a problem with evolution. After all, he would then be its' inventor (which is kind of not the most impressive work ...[text shortened]... eah, and that was goooooood. Look folks, look what I did. I'm like the best god evva'!"
    Did you read the OP or just the title of the thread? I strongly suspect it's the latter. So read the OP and see if you have anything to say about that.
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    17 May '11 15:513 edits
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Well, see, I don't believe the quote came from some nebulous "Watchtower Society publication" then.

    Not even the Watchtower Society gets the words of the Bible THAT wrong. The only conclusion I can draw is that your "quote" is not entirely accurate.
    Well, the quote is accurate and does come straight from the publication ToO mentions.

    The original writers do not purport to be providing quotes from the bible. They are simply inserting reference points that they think strengthen their exhortations. It would be like if someone quoted me as saying, "Hey, we all need to be vigilant against superstition since it is no good (Stevie Wonder's song 'Superstition'😉". And then you retort that they must have misquoted me because "Hey, we all need to be vigilant against superstition since it is no good" does not actually appear word-for-word in that song.

    EDIT: I should have read further on, since ToO already clarified this point.
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