Spirituality

Spirituality

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    11 Sep '19 08:332 edits
    @fmf said
    It's all subjective regardless of the adjectives you deploy.
    But that doesn’t negate the possibility that subjective opinions may be objectively true regardless of you labelling them as purely subjective.
  2. Subscriberdivegeester
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    11 Sep '19 09:07
    @secondson said
    Opinions- that's the operative word here. Of course they're subjective!
    But opinions are not relative to the objective existence of immutable truth.
    That is your error.
    Your error is that the immutable truth you mention, is not objective.
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    11 Sep '19 09:08
    @dj2becker said
    But that doesn’t negate the possibility that subjective opinions may be objectively true regardless of you labelling them as purely subjective.
    The key words in your post, which you should reflect on, are:

    “possibility” and “may be”
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    11 Sep '19 11:48
    @fmf said
    All we are doing here is exchanging opinions about things in the supernatural realm. Both you and me. And others who have chipped in on this thread.
    Correction. That's all YOU are doing. You have only opinions to exchange concerning things supernatural.

    As difficult as it is for you to accept and believe I know that the God of the Bible is the creator of all that exists. Beyond any shadow of doubt.

    It is an infallible and immutable truth. If you had been paying attention to what the Bible says back in the day when you identified as a Christian you would know too that truth.

    Instead of focusing on the Word of God you focused on the word of man that drew you away from the truth to a fiction.
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    11 Sep '19 11:53
    @fmf said
    It's all subjective regardless of the adjectives you deploy.
    So, with that subjective opinion, you are going to believe there are no objective immutable truths in existence.
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    11 Sep '19 12:40
    @secondson said
    Correction. That's all YOU are doing. You have only opinions to exchange concerning things supernatural.

    As difficult as it is for you to accept and believe I know that the God of the Bible is the creator of all that exists. Beyond any shadow of doubt.

    It is an infallible and immutable truth. If you had been paying attention to what the Bible says back in the day when ...[text shortened]... ng on the Word of God you focused on the word of man that drew you away from the truth to a fiction.
    You can attach whatever intensifier adjectives you want to the assertions you make, they are still your subjective opinions.
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    11 Sep '19 12:43
    @secondson said
    So, with that subjective opinion, you are going to believe there are no objective immutable truths in existence.
    That's right, stemming from your conjecture about supernatural things and divine law? No. You only have your faith and all manner of subjective assertions about reality - as you perceive it - that you make because of your faith.
  8. Subscriberdivegeester
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    11 Sep '19 12:442 edits
    @secondson said
    So, with that subjective opinion, you are going to believe there are no objective immutable truths in existence.
    An example of an objective immutable truth would be that the sun is a star.

    An example of an objective mutable truth would be that the sun is hot (it will get cold eventually)

    An example of a subjective immutable truth is “I think therefore I am”

    An example of a subjective truth is to believe that God exists.

    Edit; to everyone else a persons subjective truth is just their opinion.
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    11 Sep '19 12:47
    @dj2becker said
    But that doesn’t negate the possibility that subjective opinions may be objectively true regardless of you labelling them as purely subjective.
    It's your prerogative to call your opinions whatever you want. Regarding the things we are talking about, they are not "objectively true". They are merely opinions that, together, amount to your "faith". Does not matter how certain or earnest you are.
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    11 Sep '19 12:58
    @secondson said
    As difficult as it is for you to accept and believe I know that the God of the Bible is the creator of all that exists. Beyond any shadow of doubt.
    You are mistaken. I have no difficulty whatsoever accepting that you believe that the God of the Bible is the creator of all that exists and that you believr this beyond any shadow of doubt. I fully understand how certain you feel.
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    11 Sep '19 13:021 edit
    @secondson said
    So, with that subjective opinion, you are going to believe there are no objective immutable truths in existence.
    If I were to assert that there are immutable truths regarding supernatural beings and divine law, it would be my subjective opinion. Just as it is when you make such assertions. The strength of your certainty does not generate "objectivity".
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    11 Sep '19 14:48
    @fmf said
    You can attach whatever intensifier adjectives you want to the assertions you make, they are still your subjective opinions.
    But only in your opinion.

    For some reason it escapes your imagination that I might have certain knowledge that makes mine not an opinion, but instead a known truth.

    It is your language that's the "intensifier". You're grasping for some logic to refute the existence of "immutable truth" by making knowledge a subjective experience rendering all views as merely opinions.

    By doing so you paralyze your own argument with illogical, emotional and irrational claims of subjectivity.

    Immutable truths exist, and are understood through reason and objective logic. Your feelings are betraying you.
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    11 Sep '19 18:26
    @divegeester said
    Your error is that the immutable truth you mention, is not objective.
    Is that a fact or simply your subjective opinion?
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    11 Sep '19 18:30
    @fmf said
    If I were to assert that there are immutable truths regarding supernatural beings and divine law, it would be my subjective opinion. Just as it is when you make such assertions. The strength of your certainty does not generate "objectivity".
    That also applies to your certainty that there are no objective truths regarding spiritual matters. Would you admit that you could be wrong and that objective truths may well exist that you are not aware of? Or are you claiming absolute certainty about your precarious position?
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    11 Sep '19 18:36
    @divegeester said
    An example of an objective immutable truth would be that the sun is a star.

    An example of an objective mutable truth would be that the sun is hot (it will get cold eventually)

    An example of a subjective immutable truth is “I think therefore I am”

    An example of a subjective truth is to believe that God exists.

    Edit; to everyone else a persons subjective truth is just their opinion.
    But if God truly exists then His existence would be an objective truth that is true regardless of what anyone might think or believe about His existence. We all make assumptions that we cannot prove. That doesn’t mean that none of our assumptions can ever be true.
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