What happens....

Originally posted by Zander 88
A couple of questions came to me, but they aren't appropriate to ask in this thread. I would say you answered the question, but it isn't satisfactory to me. Anyways, thanks for your time.

It's my pleasure to share the word of God with anyone interested. If you want to discuss whatever questions you may have, just start a new thread. I'll see you there...

Peace.

Originally posted by epiphinehas
"And when people escape from the wickedness of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and then get tangled up and enslaved by sin again, they are worse off than before. It would be better if they had never known the way to righteousness than to know it and then reject the command they were given to live a holy life. They prove the truth of and when someone has been entrusted with much, even more will be required" (Luke 12:47-48).

I think the worry was this: Dead people who never heard of Jesus get preached to by God himself, but the rest of us have had to hear the "good news" from people who are dim, or mangle the message, or focus on the absurd parts of scripture, etc. Some Christians are so bad at spreading the message that one could hardly be blamed for being turned off to the religion. The silly Christian kids I went to high school with were absolutely terrible at preaching the "good news", and were probably responsible for turning more people away from Christianity that towards it. So, do those of us burdened with bad messengers get a second chance to believe after death? If not, isn't this unfair?

Of course, I think all of this is nonsense anyway, but I do want you to answer that other guy's question, without simply regurgitating passages from scripture.

Originally posted by bbarr
I think the worry was this: Dead people who never heard of Jesus get preached to by God himself, but the rest of us have had to hear the "good news" from people who are dim, or mangle the message, or focus on the absurd parts of scripture, etc. Some Christians are so bad at spreading the message that one could hardly be blamed for being turned off to the reli to answer that other guy's question, without simply regurgitating passages from scripture.

Let me get this straight: you are concerned about the possible misrepresentation of the Gospel message due to human incompetence, yet you want me to answer the other guy's question without resorting to scripture? That just might be your problem. If Jesus Christ is indeed truth, then it is incumbent upon you to seek him, regardless of the incompetence or outright hypocrisy of others claiming to speak for him. The unadulterated message is right there in the word of God for all to see.

Originally posted by epiphinehas
Let me get this straight: you are concerned about the possible misrepresentation of the Gospel message due to human incompetence, yet you want me to answer the other guy's question without resorting to scripture? That just might be your problem. If Jesus Christ is indeed truth, then it is incumbent upon you to seek him, regardless of the incompe ...[text shortened]... to speak for him. The unadulterated message is right there in the word of God for all to see.

I did not ask you to refrain from using scripture to support your view, I asked you to do more than simply regurgitate passages. Further, I am not concerned about the mere possible misinterpretation of scripture. I am concerned that there is a discrepancy between the treatment of those who have never heard the "good news" and those who have. Apparently, the former get the word directly from the horses mouth, and will be presented the best case for belief. The latter have to make do with getting the word from folks like you (and your less erudite brethren). So, if all one gets in this lifetime is a shoddy presentation of the word, will God remedy this error at the time of one's death? If so, then why should any of us believe during this lifetime? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to wait until death to see what God has to say about why we should believe?

Originally posted by bbarr
I did not ask you to refrain from using scripture to support your view, I asked you to do more than simply regurgitate passages. Further, I am not concerned about the mere possible misinterpretation of scripture. I am concerned that there is a discrepancy between the treatment of those who have never heard the "good news" and those who have. Apparently, th more reasonable to wait until death to see what God has to say about why we should believe?

First of all, consider the simplicity of the message: "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life" (John 3:16). One does not need to be a highly educated intellectual in order to understand or convey its meaning. What is required, in order to appropriate the realities indicated in the message, is trust. The simplicity of its message and its call to faith make the gospel practical for even small children.

"At that time Jesus said, ‘I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and the intelligent and have revealed them to infants; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will" (Matthew 11:25-26).

That one might hear this message preached straight from the horse's mouth is no guarantee that one would choose to taste the humility of repentance for hearing it. Many would sooner burn in hell than acknowledge the heinousness of their sins and seek forgiveness, even when forgiveness is offered, because of pride. Christ raised the dead to life, cleansed lepers, healed the sick, and gave sight to the blind, yet many people chose to reject him. Obviously being preached to by Christ Himself does not make his gospel any easier to believe.

"So the Jews gathered around him and said to him, ‘How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.’ Jesus answered, ‘I have told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father’s name testify to me; but you do not believe, because you do not belong to my sheep. My sheep hear my voice. I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish" (John 10:24-29).

The questions you pose are impossible to answer because what is involved is a matter of accountability. If one misunderstands the message of the gospel, obviously then one is responsible for seeking a true understanding; if one does not seek a true understanding, then one is held accountable to the gospel just as if one did understand it and chose not to believe it. I do not see how it could be otherwise. Those who ultimately believe in Christ are those who seek Christ. "‘Ask, and it will be given to you; search, and you will find; knock, and the door will be opened for you" (Matthew 7:7). If a person purposefully chooses not to listen to the warnings and admonitions of silly Christians, instead waiting until death to see what God himself has to say about why we should believe in him, that person would find himself standing before God in order to be judged, not preached to. The truth is, even this short post has revealed enough of the good news for anyone reading it to be held accountable, making such questions moot. Perhaps what you should ask is, 'what, then, is the purpose of hearing and believing the gospel while still alive?'

Originally posted by epiphinehas
If a person purposefully chooses not to listen to the warnings and admonitions of silly Christians, instead waiting until death to see what God himself has to say about why we should believe in him, that person would find himself standing before God in order to be judged, not preached to.

It appears to be a very unjust system where the easily gullible have a distinctly unfair advantage as they are more likely to take seriously the ranting of those 'silly Christians'. Also your location in the world (in time and space) dramatically affects the likely hood of you hearing said message.
In fact the unfairness of the system is directly shown by pointing out that Christians are not uniformly distributed across the globe. Things like birthplace and religion of your parents dramatically affects the likely hood of a person ever becoming Christian.

Originally posted by twhitehead
It appears to be a very unjust system where the easily gullible have a distinctly unfair advantage as they are more likely to take seriously the ranting of those 'silly Christians'. Also your location in the world (in time and space) dramatically affects the likely hood of you hearing said message.
In fact the unfairness of the system is directly shown b ...[text shortened]... gion of your parents dramatically affects the likely hood of a person ever becoming Christian.

It appears to be a very unjust system where the easily gullible have a distinctly unfair advantage as they are more likely to take seriously the ranting of those 'silly Christians'.

Children have no prejudices or pride of life. Pride is what causes people to not give serious consideration to God's word, because God calls us to be his servants. Only the poor of this world seek him. "Listen, my beloved brothers and sisters. Has not God chosen the poor in the world to be rich in faith and to be heirs of the kingdom that he has promised to those who love him?" (James 2:5). Take pride away and there really isn't a legitimate rationale to prevent one from immediately accepting God's gift of salvation. Even unthinking animals know how to obey the Lord:

"I have listened and heard, but they have not spoken aright; no man repents of his wickedness, saying, What have I done? Everyone turns to his individual course, as the horse rushes like a torrent into battle. Even the migratory birds are punctual to their seasons. Yes, the stork excelling in the great height of her flight in the heavens knows her appointed times of migration, and the turtledove, the swallow, and the crane observe the time of their return. But My people do not know the law of the Lord, which the lower animals instinctively recognize in so far as it applies to them" (Jeremiah 8:6-7).

Also your location in the world (in time and space) dramatically affects the likely hood of you hearing said message.
In fact the unfairness of the system is directly shown by pointing out that Christians are not uniformly distributed across the globe. Things like birthplace and religion of your parents dramatically affects the likely hood of a person ever becoming Christian.

And that only makes sense, as Christian families will seek to raise their children to be believers. Over time they are bound not to be evenly distributed, as birds of a feather flock together. Nevertheless, God sends missionaries to places where the gospel has never been heard (see 'End of the Spear'😉. God's gospel is not found everywhere because many nations have gone their own way after idols (greed), which God curses:

"You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me" (Exodus 20:4-5).