Originally posted by josephwIf He reveals Himself or issues any instructions then it will have whatever effect it is intended to have. As you know, I don't think He has revealed Himself to you. I realize you think He has and this creates "meaning" for you, but what represents "meaning" for you represents a spiritual cul-de-sac for me, and it is a cul-de-sac in which I spent a considerable number of years. I gained a better appreciation for the meaning of life having reversed out. 🙂
[b]"I think meaning in life is generated by prioritizing..."
God first. FMF second. 😉[/b]
Originally posted by FMFIt is still vanity.
Yes, a religion: "God, Jesus".
I tend to think the notion of immortality ~ its sheer straw-clutching vanity aside ~ would make life meaningless. I think meaning in life is generated by prioritizing and implementing one's hopes and plans in a realistic and non-superstitious way and it involves a combination of interpersonal relationships - loving and being lov ...[text shortened]... squandered ~ intellectually, emotionally and spiritually ~ on a narrow and far-fetched ideology.
Look, I used to think the way you do, about 40 years ago.
To think that no matter what I accomplished in life, I still end up in a hole in the ground and forgotten just seemed illogical.
How is that different from an ant?
They are productive, care for their mates in their short lives, then what?
Just continue to reproduce? Vanity indeed.
I think meaning in life is generated by prioritizing and implementing one's hopes and plans in a realistic and non-superstitious way and it involves a combination of interpersonal relationships - loving and being loved - bringing new life into the world - impacting others in positive and productive ways - always learning, always being curious - always exploring the human condition - starting perhaps with coming to terms with the fact that we all die
???? So what??? You, your family and friends will still die and cease to exist.
What is the end of providing for loved ones after you are dead? You won't even know their outcome! It is madness! Vanity!
I could tell you have not read Ecclesiastes.
It is the whole point of the book.
Originally posted by checkbaiterYour 'definition' of "vanity" makes no sense at all. I think you've turned it on its head. If that's the result of you reading a book called Ecclesiastes, it's neither here nor there as far as I am concerned. If it's only your religion that sets you apart ~ in your mind ~ from ants [or if you seek to compare me to an ant on account of the fact that I don't subscribe to your religion], then you are not experiencing the same quality of intellectual, emotional and spiritual life that I am. You should do what you feel you need to do, but your idea that accepting one's mortality is "vanity" and imagining oneself to be immortal is not "vanity" makes a nonsense of the meaning of the word "vanity".
It is still vanity.
Look, I used to think the way you do, about 40 years ago.
To think that no matter what I accomplished in life, I still end up in a hole in the ground and forgotten just seemed illogical.
How is that different from an ant?
They are productive, care for their mates in their short lives, then what?
Just continue to reproduce? Vanit ...[text shortened]... dness! Vanity!
I could tell you have not read Ecclesiastes.
It is the whole point of the book.
Originally posted by FMFBy all means, enjoy your life. Love your wife if it be the case, your friends and family. If your life is fulfilled, by all means enjoy it.
Your 'definition' of "vanity" makes no sense at all. I think you've turned it on its head. If that's the result of you reading a book called Ecclesiastes, it's neither here nor there as far as I am concerned. If it's only your religion that sets you apart ~ in your mind ~ from ants [or if you seek to compare me to an ant on account of the fact that I don't subsc ...[text shortened]... ing oneself to be immortal is not "vanity" makes a nonsense of the meaning of the word "vanity".
To me, I believe life is much, much more.
I cannot explain in a forum setting what it is like to have Jesus by way of "holy spirit" IN me.
I cannot explain what it is like to walk and talk with the Lord. Life is what you and I have, but multiplied tenfold with God.
I cannot make you relate, I cannot articulate, what it is like to see and have prayers answered, physical healing, comfort, freedom from fear of the unknown.
I wish I could explain what it is like to receive from God, to have Him open your eyes, to understand the needs of others, and then have Him give you wisdom on what to do.
Look at the simple choice God gives in the O.T.
Deut 30:19-20
I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; 20 that you may love the Lord your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days;
NKJV
It is like a simple test, and then in case you miss it, he provides the answer, "choose life"!
There are so many scriptures coming to mind, but I will try to refrain from posting them.
Originally posted by checkbaiterYes, we are coming from two different angles. My long experience as a person who held strong Christian beliefs ~ but more especially my experience of escaping those beliefs' psychological clutches and thinking for myself ~ makes me regard an unsubstantiated belief that there is "much, much more" [i.e. life after death] is a crutch and a symptom of deeper inadequacies in one's life. But I respect your autonomy and its resulting choices. By all means, enjoy your life by telling yourself that you are immortal. Personally, I think religiosity is the human spirit settling for for way less than what it is capable of.
By all means, enjoy your life. Love your wife if it be the case, your friends and family. If your life is fulfilled, by all means enjoy it.
To me, I believe life is much, much more.
Originally posted by checkbaiterMan is superior to an ant! Well done.
Man is far superior to an ant. I am talking about the cycle of life.
I said not much different. Meaning both are end products
of physical processes - you know; chemicals, energy, dna
... all that stuff. We are not that special.
& wtf is "the cycle of life" ??? You been watching the Lion King?
Originally posted by Grampy Bobby6. Write it on your neighbours wall in blood.
Only four things I'm aware of that can be done with any truth: 1) Ignore it; 2) Distort it; 3) Lie about it; or 4) Tell it.
Edit: 5) Or troll it into oblivion with ancillary comments, *asterisks* and ~tildes~ borne of practiced negative volition.
7. Have it tattooed on your back.
8. Record it using a comedy lisp and a German accent.
9. Make a youtube video naked.
10. Use a fake name and email it to lonely women on dating sites.
You really lack imagination Gramps.
Originally posted by FMF"I gained a better appreciation for the meaning of life having reversed out."
If He reveals Himself or issues any instructions then it will have whatever effect it is intended to have. As you know, I don't think He has revealed Himself to you. I realize you think He has and this creates "meaning" for you, but what represents "meaning" for you represents a spiritual cul-de-sac for me, and it is a cul-de-sac in which I spent a considerable number of years. I gained a better appreciation for the meaning of life having reversed out. 🙂
"Reversed out" meaning you decided that your own revelation of yourself trumped God's revelation of Himself?
If you even suspect that there is a God, how, and by what means do you think you know that? What gives you even an inkling of an idea of who and what God is, or that He even exists, if you see nothing in creation that indicates God's existence?