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Originally posted by greenpawn34oh great one! what do we owe this presence of yours in the spirituality forum? for it is well understood that it is the haunt of the desperate and the damned, not to mention other types of agnostics and atheists. Watch out for those latter guys, they got pointy ears and are all high on Lord of the Rings trilogy and even their alter egos have alter egos, and weird names, like Sauron.
Why does God hide?
He's not hiding,
We are proof that God has tea breaks. Wait till he comes
back from having a cigarette and sees what we have done
to his planet.
(I think I'd hide as well if I created us).
Originally posted by FreakyKBH😴
You've made no such case. In fact, the story itself flatly contradicts your wild claims, without requiring any leaps in logic.
I assumed nothing in my approaching the story, but instead, let the story tell itself. What is says, I believe. What you try to make it say, I reject.
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Originally posted by twhitehead[/b]The knowledge of God is always a good thing, it helps with understanding
That seems like a contradiction to me. Either we would fear God if he revealed himself or we wouldn't.
[b]I'm also saying that we tend to let things go we should not, or do
things we should not because that is in our heart to do. I will speak for
myself but I do tend to from time to time do things I know are wrong
while I'm doing them, because I wan why knowledge of God was a bad thing, now you are saying it is a good thing. Which is it?
reality.
Kelly
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Originally posted by twhitehead[/b]Do you see now God yes or no?
That seems like a contradiction to me. Either we would fear God if he revealed himself or we wouldn't.
[b]I'm also saying that we tend to let things go we should not, or do
things we should not because that is in our heart to do. I will speak for
myself but I do tend to from time to time do things I know are wrong
while I'm doing them, because I wan why knowledge of God was a bad thing, now you are saying it is a good thing. Which is it?
He has revealed Himself through His creation we will be without an excuse
when we stand before Him; but to actually see Him in the here and now
no you don't get to see Him. The truth of it all is before us, but it is hidden
in my opinion right in front of us all.
Kelly
Originally posted by FreakyKBHThe discussion ran out of gas, not the arguments. Takes two to tango.
That's pretty much what I figured. Cut and run as soon as your already-empty argument runs out of gas. Great job with the accusations, though!
You give only the appearance of actually responding to arguments, but it's all just a sham - a further excuse for more of your typical mindless platitudes and empty assertions that you just outright refuse to back up.
Same thing happened in your responses to LemonJello; he raised substantive points; your response is to attempt to turn it into a windier version of an "Is too!" "Is not!" nursery-style slagging match.
And now the childish crap continues in my direction. What's next, will you call me a "chicken" if I don't keep on, futilely trying to make you actually address my arguments or back up one of your own?!
Jesus Christ. Grow up. 🙄
Originally posted by SwissGambitThat's the thing with guys like you: quick to proclaim your position as solid and incontrovertible, but we're just supposed to take your word for it. Self-serving is the term that comes to mind.
The discussion ran out of gas, not the arguments. Takes two to tango.
You give only the appearance of actually responding to arguments, but it's all just a sham - a further excuse for more of your typical mindless platitudes and empty assertions that you just outright refuse to back up.
Same thing happened in your responses to LemonJello; he raised ...[text shortened]... actually address my arguments or back up one of your own?!
Jesus Christ. Grow up. 🙄
When your argument is demolished (and this typically takes very little effort), you accuse the other other of immaturity, obfuscation, lack of sophistication or fill-in-the-blank. When forced to actually hold to anything remotely resembling an objective standard, it's time for the ad hominem attacks, as observed in your last post.
Why even bother trying to set the record straight with people like you, since you're not even after truth in the first place?
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Originally posted by FreakyKBHWhile we're at it, why are you even back on this forum? What's the point?
Why even bother trying to set the record straight with people like you, since you're not even after truth in the first place?
I would have been happy to continue debating, but it became clear that all I was ultimately going to get from you was lame excuses like the exegesis excuse.
Originally posted by SwissGambitWhile we're at it, why are you even back on this forum? What's the point?
While we're at it, why are you even back on this forum? What's the point?
I would have been happy to continue debating, but it became clear that all I was ultimately going to get from you was lame excuses like the exegesis excuse.
Touche.
I would have been happy to continue debating, but it became clear that all I was ultimately going to get from you was lame excuses like the exegesis excuse.
Even without the reality of exegesis, your argument fell short of anything remotely close to plausibility. The only way your argument could have been seen to hold water is if one were to project an assumption on isolated parts of the story while completely ignore other part and the whole.
Originally posted by FreakyKBHOf course, I reject your evaluation, but we'll just leave it at that.
[b]While we're at it, why are you even back on this forum? What's the point?
Touche.
I would have been happy to continue debating, but it became clear that all I was ultimately going to get from you was lame excuses like the exegesis excuse.
Even without the reality of exegesis, your argument fell short of anything remotely close to plausib ...[text shortened]... an assumption on isolated parts of the story while completely ignore other part and the whole.[/b]
Originally posted by Monty348The faith and belief comes first; then God reveals Himself. Not physically, but in your heart and mind... usually through deep, unmistakable, symbolic messages.
In the Bible, God walked and talked with Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.
As a searching pilgrim trying to believe that God is real and present in the world today, I wonder often why he does not reveal himself more fully to those who search for him?
I'm very interested in what other people think about this.
When one is in a position of disbelief, and the bible supports this, they can't truly search for God. Think about it, how can someone truly search for something they don't believe exists in the first place? A half-hearted effort is the best one can muster up in a search for God, if they don't already have faith. And it's not the fault of the half-hearted seeker; they don't have full-fledged faith and belief because God hasn't yet transformed them through the power of the Holy Spirit.
I think the best an Agnostic such as yourself can do is keep your ear to the ground, stay involved in conversations about God, and try your best though it is uncomfortable, to pray that God enters your heart.
Be at ease, knowing that if God doesn't do it on your timetable, that doesn't mean God isn't going to do it. In my case God waited 36 years.
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Originally posted by KellyJay…He has revealed Himself through HIS creation we will be WITHOUT an EXCUSE when we stand before Him;
Do you see now God yes or no?
He has revealed Himself through His creation we will be without an excuse
when we stand before Him; but to actually see Him in the here and now
no you don't get to see Him. The truth of it all is before us, but it is hidden
in my opinion right in front of us all.
Kelly[/b]
..…(my emphasis)
Let us get this straight; you are saying that we should idiotically conclude from the mere fact that ‘the universe exist’ that “therefore a ‘God’ must have created the universe ” even though it is CLEARLY obvious and logically self-evident that it does NOT logically follow from:
1, the universe exists
That:
2, therefore a ‘God’ must have created the universe
?
And, what is even more idiotic, if we do NOT make this moronic and idiotic illogical conclusion, despite this “God” that is supposed to not only exist (according to some) but be all-knowing and all intelligent, this “God” will punish us for not doing so!? -why? -because “we would be WITHOUT an EXCUSE when we stand before Him“ -“WITHOUT an EXCUSE” that is for failing to think totally idiotically and illogically by concluding (2) from (1) above 😛 (perhaps this “God” actually WANTS us to be stupid and would be offended by anyone using their brain?)
….The truth of it all is before us, but it is HIDDEN
in my opinion right in front of us all.
…
If this “truth” that we are supposed to ‘see’ is “HIDDEN” then how can we be “WITHOUT an EXCUSE” for not ‘seeing’ it? 😛
If this “truth” that we are supposed to ‘see’ is made “HIDDEN” to us then that fact would definitely be an extremely good “EXCUSE” for us not ‘seeing‘ it!