Why Evangelicals Hate Jesus

Originally posted by Suzianne
Who is mocking whom?

All I see is you acting all 'holier-than-thou' while conveniently forgetting Jesus' command to love your Christian brothers. When will you stop paying 'lip-service' to this?

Edit: If it makes you feel any better, you're both guilty of this to some extent. You guys are fighting like children. No, worse than children.

Would you perfer that I just "turn the other cheek" and let him make hateful untrue propaganda statements about Evangelical Christians. He might as well include the Jews in there too. You know what the JWs think about them.

Originally posted by RJHinds
Would you perfer that I just "turn the other cheek" and let him make hateful untrue propaganda statements about Evangelical Christians. He might as well include the Jews in there too. You know what the JWs think about them.

Oh really? Just how we do feel about the Jews oh wise one?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
so you equate violence with making a rope and driving out some sheep and cattle form the temple, wow is it any wonder you people have caricatured the Christ. I am absolutely astonished and i mean that sincerely at the attempts of evangelicals to support what is naught but a gross misrepresentation amounting to a horrible caricature of the Biblical C ...[text shortened]... salvation forget other people,

look at what is being said here, its absolutely astonishing.

How about the 180,000 Assyrians destroyed by God's angel? Do you hold God in contempt for this slaughter?

Originally posted by galveston75
Oh really? Just how we do feel about the Jews oh wise one?

Jehovah's Witnesses believe they have replaced the Jews as God's chosen people and His Witnesses, thus the term Jehovah's Witnesses. It is called Replacement Theology by theologians.

On pages 25-26 of the book “You Can Live Forever In Paradise On Earth” published in 1982, it says this of the Jews:

“Was God really their father? Did God accept their form of religion? Not at all!”... Jews are “from their father the Devil, and they wish to do his desires.” The Jewish religion “served the interest of the Devil.” And they concluded that because of their evil, the Jews “were on the way to destruction."

Anyone coming in contact with 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' will sooner or later be reminded of how terribly they suffered in Nazi Germany. Jehovah’s Witnesses are guilty of horrible distortion of facts and of historical revisionism! First, let’s see what their claims are, as presented by propagandists of the sect.

In their official publication ('Watchtower' May 15, 1975 p. 294) they write “thousands of European Jews can testify that one religious group in Germany underwent persecution equal to that heaped upon the Jews: ‘Jehovah’s Witnesses’ ”.

But equating their suffering to that of the Jews, apparently wasn’t enough for them. In another publication they went further: “...a horrible Nazi persecution of 'Jehovah’s Witnesses', worse than that of the Jews”.

But even that apparently was just not enough! In yet another publication of the sect under the headline 'The Holocaust - victims or martyrs?' they 'kindly' explain that “all those who suffered as a result of the Holocaust were victims, but only a minority were truly martyrs.” Jews just like Poles, Russians and Ukrainians were merely victims. “But the case of 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' in Europe was different.” They and only they were true martyrs of the Holocaust.

On January 30, 1933 Hitler came to power in Germany. On April 4, 1933, the German police seized the sect’s offices in the city of Magdeburg. The reason for the seizure, for sure, wasn’t any anti-Nazi activity by 'Jehovah’s Witnesses', because there simply wasn’t any such activity. In the book 'Encyclopedia of the Holocaust' (published by 'Yad Vashem'😉 it’s written about the 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' that before the years 1933-1935 “there isn’t any evidence of any real action by them against the regime.” The reasons for Nazi persecution were probably the refusal of some members of the sect to join the German army.Their refusal to join the German army also didn’t come from any opposition to Nazis per se, because in the same time members of the sect refused to join American, Canadian and British armies, fighting against the Nazis. That was one of the reasons they were outlawed in Canada during WWII. At the same time they were also outlawed in Australia.

And now leaders of 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' are cynically trying to claim that the reason for Nazi persecution was “favorable comments in earlier Watch Tower publication about the Jewish people and strong denunciations of anti-Semitism.”

As a response to seizure of their Magdeburg branch, leaders of the sect organized an assembly in Berlin, on June 25, 1933. The goal of the assembly was clear – to publicly declare that the Nazis have nothing to fear from 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' and to declare support for Hitler’s regime. Two leaders of the sect, J.F. Rutherford and N. Knorr especially came from America to see how they can achieve this goal.

The assembly unanimously adopted a special statement, written by the leaders of the sect, 'Declaration of Facts.' A personal letter of J.F. Rutherford (president of 'Jehovah’s Witnesses'😉 to Hitler accompanied the Declaration of Facts. Jehovah’s Witnesses themselves translated the 'Declaration of Facts' from the original German into English and published it in their yearbook in 1934. In all their historical falsifications Jehovah’s Witnesses always skip the contents of these two documents and hope that nobody will ever find out.

The truth is that the contents of both of these documents are exceedingly anti-Semitic and show the clear attempt by 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' to cooperate with Hitler. The following is some of there statments:

“The present government of Germany has declared emphatically against Big Business Oppressors… Such is exactly our position.”

“It has been the commercial Jews of the British-American empire that have built up and carried on Big Business as a means of exploiting and oppressing the peoples of many nations.”

“Instead of being against the principles advocated by the Government of Germany, we stand squarely for such principles. A careful examination of our books and literature will disclose the fact that the very high ideals held and promulgated by the present national government are set forth in and endorsed and strongly emphasized in our publications."

“The [Nazi] Party, as such, represents the viewpoint of positive Christianity without associating itself with a specific confession. It opposes the Jewish-materialist spirit domestically and abroad.”

The Nazis were not impressed by this attempt at cooperation by the 'Jehovah’s Witnesses' and rejected such unwanted partners. And only then, having no other choice, did the leaders of the sect come out against the Nazis. And now propagandists of the sect are busy distorting historical facts and covering them up. All this so as to paint themselves as innocent victims instead of would-be partners of Hitler.


http://www.yadlachimusa.net/?CategoryID=203&ArticleID=577

Originally posted by RJHinds
Jehovah's Witnesses believe they have replaced the Jews as God's chosen people and His Witnesses, thus the term Jehovah's Witnesses. It is called Replacement Theology by theologians.

On pages 25-26 of the book “You Can Live Forever In Paradise On Earth” published in 1982, it says this of the Jews:

“Was God really their father? Did God accept their for ...[text shortened]... http://www.yadlachimusa.net/?CategoryID=203&ArticleID=577

I had never heard any of this, very interesting, thank you for the history.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I had never heard any of this, very interesting, thank you for the history.

It's not very good history though. The telling bit if you go to the linked document is that Rudolf Hess, Hitler's deputy, was apparently commandant of Auschwitz at the same time as being held captive in Britain, having flown there on an abortive peace mission. If they can't get that right I'd have grave doubts about the rest of it.

Originally posted by Kepler
It's not very good history though. The telling bit if you go to the linked document is that Rudolf Hess, Hitler's deputy, was apparently commandant of Auschwitz at the same time as being held captive in Britain, having flown there on an abortive peace mission. If they can't get that right I'd have grave doubts about the rest of it.

Here is the statement in the article:

Rudolf Hess, commandant of Auschwitz, in his book of memoirs 'The Commandant of Auschwitz Testifies' describes the faith and behavior of several female members of 'Jehovah’s Witnesses', who worked as faithful servants of SS officers in Auschwitz:
“The strange thing was that all of them were convinced that causing suffering to the Jews and killing them was justified, because their ancestors betrayed God.”

It was Rudolf Hoess that was commandant of Auschwitz. They only got the spelling wrong probably because the similarity in pronounciation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudolf_H%C3%B6ss

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1946hoess.html

People often misspell peoples names, and other things, so a misspell word is a trivial reason to doubt the rest of it. My name is spell Hines or Heinz by many people and it does not make me doubt other things they say just because they don't spell it Hinds.

P.S. Note also that they did not identify him as Hitler's deputy as you did. So obviously they are not talking about the same person you are.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
once again its not about the democratic party, its about evangelicals and the caricature that they have portrayed of Jesus, how you could have missed this is quite beyond me.

You completly overlook the obvious. The progressive technique of stealing from others in order to enrich their political base is older than dirt, and something Hitler did as well. It then gives rise to genocide due to their political base looking the other way because of the nice lifestyle that they are afforded.

Again, I don't take issue with giving to the poor, but I do take issue with the progressive way of theft to redististribute wealth. It is simply a way to bribe the average voter into embracing abject evil such as the abortion industry or Nazi death camps.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
so you equate violence with making a rope and driving out some sheep and cattle form the temple, wow is it any wonder you people have caricatured the Christ. I am absolutely astonished and i mean that sincerely at the attempts of evangelicals to support what is naught but a gross misrepresentation amounting to a horrible caricature of the Biblical C ...[text shortened]... salvation forget other people,

look at what is being said here, its absolutely astonishing.

I have simply provided evidence that Jesus was not a pacifist, but you refuse to acknowledge this fact.

However, you come here to malign an entire group of people without so much as a shred of evidence. You say that evangelicals oppose giving to the poor yet offer no evidence whatsoever.

So I will provide the first evidence of this thread. Here is some evidence that those who consider themselves to be religious, including evangelicals, are much more likely to give to the poor and much more likely to consider themselves conservative.

http://www.hoover.org/publications/policy-review/article/6577

Conversely, atheists are much less likely to give to the poor and much more likely to support forcing government to do it for them due to their collective guilty consciences. In the interim, they will also use this money to support abortion, gay marriage, wars abroad, and endless corruption and mismanagement of taxpayer funds. And to think that evangelicals have a problem with this, it boggles the mind Robbie.

And lastly, for someone who claims to be apolitical as a JW you seem to be preoccupied with politics Robbie. That's called being a hypocrite.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
How about the 180,000 Assyrians destroyed by God's angel? Do you hold God in contempt for this slaughter?

I do not, but I hold evangelical Christians in contempt for making a caricature of the Christ.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I do not, but I hold evangelical Christians in contempt for making a caricature of the Christ.

He who is without sin cast the first stone.

Originally posted by whodey
I have simply provided evidence that Jesus was not a pacifist, but you refuse to acknowledge this fact.

However, you come here to malign an entire group of people without so much as a shred of evidence. You say that evangelicals oppose giving to the poor yet offer no evidence whatsoever.

So I will provide the first evidence of this thread. Here is som ...[text shortened]... ical as a JW you seem to be preoccupied with politics Robbie. That's called being a hypocrite.

First of all we are talking of over turning the tables of money changers who were inappropriately using the temple for business purposes ( i am sure many evangelicals would have agreed with the practice, given their love of corporate business) and Christ, demonstrated his contempt for the practice but over turning those tables and it driving out the animals with a rope. To attempt to use this as a justification that Christ was predisposed towards the use of violence or a pretext that the foreign invasion of a sovereign nation is Biblically justifiable is ludicrous, it was a special instance. That Christ never attempted to defend himself when illegally apprehended for sedition and on trial for his life should be evidence enough for any Christian. Can you think of a single instance where he wielded a sword, a spear, a shield, no neither can I.

I have provided a plethora of evidence all of it Biblical and I have not intended to malign anyone, simply sought to understand how the Biblical Christ could have been so misconstrued as to have been rendered unrecognisable, a hideous distortion of the reality and to try to recognise the elements which have led to this caricature. I may no apologies for having done so.

As for evangelicals not giving to he poor, RJHinds the epitome of the evangelical Christian publicly stated that Christ was not interested in the poor and of course was soundly refuted.

So far as i understand it, the explanations given have been as follows.

1. lack of knowledge on the part of evangelical Christians
2. people make images of God for themselves (alluded to in the article)
3. various attempts to justify the caricature on the basis of, not every everyone has done so, or what about this instance, or that instance, which in themselves, are not really reasons at all.
4. various logical fallacies and irrelevancies, Robbie is a hypocrite, atheists are less likely to give to charity, etc etc etc

and of course I have failed to mention probably the real reason, that political policy has probably contorted the evangelicals beliefs to the point where the image of the Biblical Christ is no longer recognisable. Which of the evangelicals will man up and say it aint so?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
First of all we are talking of over turning the tables of money changers who were inappropriately using the temple for business purposes ( i am sure many evangelicals would have agreed with the practice, given their love of corporate business) and Christ, demonstrated his contempt for the practice but over turning those tables and it driving out the ...[text shortened]... ical Christ is no longer recognisable. Which of the evangelicals will man up and say it aint so?

http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/hitler-nazi.php


Robbie, what say you about this? The above link?

It appears that your organization collaborated with the Government
of Germany at the time.

At best it suggests that your organization was in dealings with the
Government of the day which according to your teachings is wrong
for you teach the following.

Do not be of the world and its organizations. Be ye separate from the world
for the world has been delivered onto the Devil.


At worst, it declares that your organization attempted to work with
the Nazis in order to gain favour and continue to exist and carry on its
work in 1930's Germany.

When Rutherford's plan failed, only then did the JW's take a stand
against Hitlers Government.

Either way it doesn't look good.

Your organization failed to obey God's command to be separate
from worldly institutions. Collaborated with the Nazis and agreed
with them that the Jewish people were responsible for all of the ills
in 1930's Germany.

Here is another link which makes this claim.

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/sleeping_with_enemy.htm