@Rajk999 saidWhy did you get on airplanes and boats to arrive in the Middle East and begin displacing the locals through deception and violence?
Yeah .. kinda weird that people try to avoid those who want to kill them, or spoil their lives in some way ... strange.
Did you think those people would welcome you?
You are complaining that you are being violently resisted while ethnically cleansing a land.
Excuse me if I forget to shed a tear.
@Philokalia saidPrior to 1915, anyone could travel to the Ottoman Empire and settle down. After that British Empire did not discourage immigrants. People moved all over the world. There was no deception, neither was there need for Arabs to welcome anyone, as they did not own Palestine. I think you are missing a few screws, because the more you talk the more nonsense comes out of your mouth.
Why did you get on airplanes and boats to arrive in the Middle East and begin displacing the locals through deception and violence?
Did you think those people would welcome you?
You are complaining that you are being violently resisted while ethnically cleansing a land.
Excuse me if I forget to shed a tear.
@Rajk999 saidI am missing screws? You are the one who supports the mass migration of Jews from Europe and America to displace the local Arab population because you suddenly support British imperialism.
Prior to 1915, anyone could travel to the Ottoman Empire and settle down. After that British Empire did not discourage immigrants. People moved all over the world. There was no deception, neither was there need for Arabs to welcome anyone, as they did not own Palestine. I think you are missing a few screws, because the more you talk the more nonsense comes out of your mouth.
Keep in mind that the British understood the immense problems & dificulties with the violent, terrorist Zionists:
Following the London Conference in February and March 1939, the British Government published a White Paper which proposed a limit to Jewish immigration from Europe, restrictions on Jewish land purchases, and a programme for creating an independent state to replace the Mandate within ten years. This was seen by the Yishuv as betrayal of the mandatory terms, especially in light of the increasing persecution of Jews in Europe. In response, Zionists organised Aliyah Bet, a programme of illegal immigration into Palestine. Lehi, a small group of extremist Zionists, staged armed attacks on British authorities in Palestine. However, the Jewish Agency, which represented the mainstream Zionist leadership and most of the Jewish population, still hoped to persuade Britain to allow resumed Jewish immigration and cooperated with Britain during the Second World War.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandatory_Palestine
Everyone, sooner or later, regrets giving an inch to the Zionists, who always take a mile.
And who, as we see in this thread, have no way of debating the legitimacy of their state because it is absolutely founded in the imperialist mode of being.
Can you give me non-imperialist logic, logic that does not operate off of "might makes right?"
@Rajk999 saidDont think have to wait for a milestone. My question will remain here below. Feel free to drop a reply back when you think you have a sensible answer (which I am sure you wont!)
Im done because whenever these discussions run too long my chess suffers. I went from 1600 to 1400. Got to concentrate on my moves. Start another thread in about 4 weeks when the Gaza reconstruction starts. I will participate.
"From the Hamas perspective though, they were already at war. Israel was doing illegal occupation and expansion of the settlements. Also imposing the long standing Gaza blockade.
So there..."
@sameeh saidIt makes no difference. They were always at war, so the war continues. It will end at the release of the hostages and the end of Hamas.
Dont think have to wait for a milestone. My question will remain here below. Feel free to drop a reply back when you think you have a sensible answer (which I am sure you wont!)
"From the Hamas perspective though, they were already at war. Israel was doing illegal occupation and expansion of the settlements. Also imposing the long standing Gaza blockade.
So there..."
@Philokalia saidIm starting to feel sorry for you. While it is nice to review the history of events, as it stands the Jews own Palestine, and there is no force that can move them. Apparently for people like you, that is a problem.
I am missing screws? You are the one who supports the mass migration of Jews from Europe and America to displace the local Arab population because you suddenly support British imperialism.
Keep in mind that the British understood the immense problems & dificulties with the violent, terrorist Zionists:
[quote]Following the London Conference in February and March 1939 ...[text shortened]... ]
Can you give me non-imperialist logic, logic that does not operate off of "might makes right?"
@Rajk999 saidThe usual distraction once again.. when you dont have answers to pointed questions, just state something else and escape 🙂
Im starting to feel sorry for you. While it is nice to review the history of events, as it stands the Jews own Palestine, and there is no force that can move them. Apparently for people like you, that is a problem.
Only proves too well that you do realize the Jewish side lacks legal or moral righteousness, but you just wont admit.
I think you will respond to this too with a snide remark, or some quote about jewish greatness. Let me tell you right away that it wont help one bit.
@sameeh saidIts what happens when you try to own something not belonging to you. In 1915 Palestine was owned by the British, Not the Arabs.
The usual distraction once again.. when you dont have answers to pointed questions, just state something else and escape 🙂
Only proves too well that you do realize the Jewish side lacks legal or moral righteousness, but you just wont admit.
I think you will respond to this too with a snide remark, or some quote about jewish greatness. Let me tell you right away that it wont help one bit.
@Rajk999 saidThe problem is not Jews. The problem is not even Jews living in Palestine, per se - the idea of an Arab-Jewish federated state that guarantees rights for one another and facilitates economic development in the region and illustrates that secular, democratic norms can be upheld is powerful and amazing.
Im starting to feel sorry for you. While it is nice to review the history of events, as it stands the Jews own Palestine, and there is no force that can move them. Apparently for people like you, that is a problem.
That is what I am pulling for.
What bothers me is the genocide being committed by violent Zionists who believe that the arc of history grants them some special role to occupy that land, cleanse it from foreigners, and to become some kind of beacon toward the world. This is, of course, absurdity, and it is only possible with the absurd "chosen people" narrative.
@Philokalia saidYou are dreaming. That could have happened in 1948, but the Arabs wanted war. Read your history. Too late now. No Jew wants to have anything to do with Islam.
The problem is not Jews. The problem is not even Jews living in Palestine, per se - the idea of an Arab-Jewish federated state that guarantees rights for one another and facilitates economic development in the region and illustrates that secular, democratic norms can be upheld is powerful and amazing.
That is what I am pulling for.
What bothers me is the genocide b ...[text shortened]... d. This is, of course, absurdity, and it is only possible with the absurd "chosen people" narrative.
@Rajk999 saidThe error here is that the Jews by 1948 had made it clear that they wanted a state of their own, and the British were dead set on creating a separate state for the Jews.
You are dreaming. That could have happened in 1948, but the Arabs wanted war. Read your history. Too late now. No Jew wants to have anything to do with Islam.
The British had played the Palestinians, and they were using their control as an imperial power to allow it.
The reasons go back to the Balfour Declaration. Basically, the British used Jews in Europe to rally support for the war and to get finances. Jews also in America were manipulating foreign policy to try to get their Zionist state.
It was a Zionist project from the start - the creation of a Jewish state for Jewish people, and it was not designed to integrate the local Palestinians as Palestinians.
You are complaining that the local people were unhappy that you planned to displace them & create a Jewish ethnonationalist state that excluded them.
... But it is notewrothy that some amount of Zionists that the Palestinians (correctly, mind you!) were descended from the HEbrews, juust like them, and that they would be interested in converting to Judaism and leaving Islam and Christianity.
Of course, that absolutely did not happen, lol.
@Philokalia saidWell of course it was the British intention to create a homeland for the Jews, so the land was partitioned. If the Arabs were a smart people [and they are not], they would have joined with the Jews to create the Arab/Jewish state, and work together to create peace and prosperity for all. But they are the ones that joined up with surrounding Arab nations to form a coalition war party to attack the Jews.
The error here is that the Jews by 1948 had made it clear that they wanted a state of their own, and the British were dead set on creating a separate state for the Jews.
The British had played the Palestinians, and they were using their control as an imperial power to allow it.
The reasons go back to the Balfour Declaration. Basically, the British used Jews in Euro ...[text shortened]... g to Judaism and leaving Islam and Christianity.
Of course, that absolutely did not happen, lol.
In case you forgot there were many smart Arabs in Palestine that did not participate in this first war of 1948, and they now live in Israel in relative peace and security, unlike in Gaza and West Bank. So there are some smart Arabs, and they know how to live with the Jews.
One group is smart and the other stupid.
@Rajk999 saidOh geez, do you really have to lead off with 'if the Arabs were a smart people (and they are not) like that..? I know you must have some anxiety about the fact that you advance racism and highly unpopular narratives so rushing to put them out there yourself is somehow a reliever of stress, but you are just being antagonistic and irritating.
Well of course it was the British intention to create a homeland for the Jews, so the land was partitioned. If the Arabs were a smart people [and they are not], they would have joined with the Jews to create the Arab/Jewish state, and work together to create peace and prosperity for all. But they are the ones that joined up with surrounding Arab nations to form a coalition ...[text shortened]... me smart Arabs, and they know how to live with the Jews.
One group is smart and the other stupid.
But yes, I can also repeat this old question for you: if people are dumb, do they forfeit the right to their home?
And here is the other question:
If a thief takes your home, do yuou become satisfied if he offers to let you live on the remainder of the land that he is disinterested in? Of course the Arabs formed a coalition to resist this.
But this brings up another question - if you can be honest at all:
If might makes right for the English and the Jews who can simply acquire land through violence and deception, why are you so bothered that the Arab world will physically resist the Jews?
If it is OK for the Jews to murder hundreds of thousands of Palestinians in these last years, why was October 7th so bad? It's just another battle in this war. Why do you deny the legitimacy of the means to your enemies which you relish for yourself?
@Philokalia saidYeah .. it is dumb to put in your Charter that you want to kill all Jews. I notice you dont call that racist. The rest of your post is nonsense.
Oh geez, do you really have to lead off with 'if the Arabs were a smart people (and they are not) like that..? I know you must have some anxiety about the fact that you advance racism and highly unpopular narratives so rushing to put them out there yourself is somehow a reliever of stress, but you are just being antagonistic and irritating.
But yes, I can also re ...[text shortened]... his war. Why do you deny the legitimacy of the means to your enemies which you relish for yourself?
Whats going on is karma on a grand scale. You want Jews dead, and you rape, kill and kidnap, and abuse. .. then dont cry now. Arab Palestinians are an evil sick bunch, and I have no pity for them.