@no1marauder saidThat is a very low death toll.
Could you tell that to the 1632 reported dead from COVID today in the US? https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us
Probably due to another variant.
Covid death counts take months to know they are accurate though, remember? You have disputed short term deaths before. Why are you accepting those short term numbers now?
It is because it supports your position now when it didn't before.
@metal-brain said"Low"? Multiply it by 365 and tell me if it's "low" esp. as compared to the flu, like SH keeps insisting COVID is no worse then.
That is a very low death toll.
Probably due to another variant.
Covid death counts take months to know they are accurate though, remember? You have disputed short term deaths before. Why are you accepting those short term numbers now?
It is because it supports your position now when it didn't before.
Sure, deaths trail by a bit but cases are rising again due, in part, to COVID fans like SH getting their way and many States not taking wise precautions (as well as litigation started by right wingers blocking various government health measures). It's doubtful deaths will drop in the immediate future esp. with the holidays and indoor gatherings.
@no1marauder saidUnusually low, 600,000 deaths "with" covid, or 1.8 per 1000. At the end of 2020 it was suspected that over 30% of Americans had had covid. If the normal morbidity rate is over 8.5 per 1000 then it would seem to me that the death rate "with" covid would be 30% of 8.5, or 2.55 per 1000 allowing for it being completely benign, which I know it is not. This suggests that even without deaths "from" covid, deaths "with" should be near 850,000.
"Low"? Multiply it by 365 and tell me if it's "low" esp. as compared to the flu, like SH keeps insisting COVID is no worse then.
Sure, deaths trail by a bit but cases are rising again due, in part, to COVID fans like SH getting their way and many States not taking wise precautions (as well as litigation started by right wingers blocking various government health measur ...[text shortened]... It's doubtful deaths will drop in the immediate future esp. with the holidays and indoor gatherings.
Again, why is the "toll" so low, and why do you insist on saying it is so high.
@jimmac saidIt kills more than 10x more than flu.
Unusually low, 600,000 deaths "with" covid, or 1.8 per 1000. At the end of 2020 it was suspected that over 30% of Americans had had covid. If the normal morbidity rate is over 8.5 per 1000 then it would seem to me that the death rate "with" covid would be 30% of 8.5, or 2.55 per 1000 allowing for it being completely benign, which I know it is not. This suggests that even witho ...[text shortened]... be near 850,000.
Again, why is the "toll" so low, and why do you insist on saying it is so high.
But, 9-11 only killed 3000 people, why get your knickers in a twist over that?
However, it’s the hospitalisation rate (if I have to explain this one more time, I’m gonna have to shoot me a republican) which is what has to be controlled.
@shavixmir saidThe hospitalization rate is the "only" thing that would concern me at this point, but sadly, with so many lies and so much fear created I am not sure that I would be that concerned with what the mainstream media quotes.
It kills more than 10x more than flu.
But, 9-11 only killed 3000 people, why get your knickers in a twist over that?
However, it’s the hospitalisation rate (if I have to explain this one more time, I’m gonna have to shoot me a republican) which is what has to be controlled.
@jimmac saidYou consider almost a million Americans dying from a disease in a little over a year and a half to be "low"?
Unusually low, 600,000 deaths "with" covid, or 1.8 per 1000. At the end of 2020 it was suspected that over 30% of Americans had had covid. If the normal morbidity rate is over 8.5 per 1000 then it would seem to me that the death rate "with" covid would be 30% of 8.5, or 2.55 per 1000 allowing for it being completely benign, which I know it is not. This suggests that even witho ...[text shortened]... be near 850,000.
Again, why is the "toll" so low, and why do you insist on saying it is so high.
@no1marauder said"From" absolutely not, but "with" Yes.
You consider almost a million Americans dying from a disease in a little over a year and a half to be "low"?
over 2,800,000 die every year, a simple fact of life. If well over 30% of Americans have had covid then it stands to reason that in excess of 840,000 will die "with" covid even if it is never fatal, which it can be.
@no1marauder saidWhy don't you compare it to the flu?
"Low"? Multiply it by 365 and tell me if it's "low" esp. as compared to the flu, like SH keeps insisting COVID is no worse then.
Sure, deaths trail by a bit but cases are rising again due, in part, to COVID fans like SH getting their way and many States not taking wise precautions (as well as litigation started by right wingers blocking various government health measur ...[text shortened]... It's doubtful deaths will drop in the immediate future esp. with the holidays and indoor gatherings.
Omicron is milder than other variants. It exchanged genetic material with a cold coronavirus at some point. It is not as deadly as it once was.
When vaccinated people say they have a mild case that does not mean the vaccine is working. It means they have the milder variant, omicron.
1 edit
@jimmac saidI'm not interested in these crank claims; the figures come from death certificates where the preparers are instructed only to put COVID in as a cause of death where the medical evidence supports it:
"From" absolutely not, but "with" Yes.
over 2,800,000 die every year, a simple fact of life. If well over 30% of Americans have had covid then it stands to reason that in excess of 840,000 will die "with" covid even if it is never fatal, which it can be.
"If COVID–19 played a role in the death,"
"When determining whether COVID–19 played a role in the
cause of death, follow the CDC clinical criteria for evaluating a
person under investigation for COVID–19 and, where possible,
conduct appropriate laboratory testing using guidance provided
by CDC or local health authorities."
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/vsrg/vsrg03-508.pdf
So no, it's not just a "coincidence" like you seem to be suggesting. Moreover, the US experienced well over 600,000 excess deaths from March 2020 to February 2021. https://www.nber.org/papers/w29503
In 2019, there were 2,854,838 resident deaths in the US, an increase of only 15,633 from 2018. https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db395.htm
In 2020, there were 3,358,814 resident deaths in the US, an increase of about 500,000 from 2019. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7014e1.htm
If anything, the evidence indicates that deaths from COVID were significantly undercounted.
@no1marauder said"If anything, the evidence indicates that deaths from COVID were significantly undercounted."
I'm not interested in these crank claims; the figures come from death certificates where the preparers are instructed only to put COVID in as a cause of death where the medical evidence supports it:
"If COVID–19 played a role in the death,"
"When determining whether COVID–19 played a role in the
cause of death, follow the CDC clinical criteria for evaluating a
per ...[text shortened]... 1.htm
If anything, the evidence indicates that deaths from COVID were significantly undercounted.
Stop repeating propaganda. I created a whole thread about that and you proved nothing on it.
https://rumble.com/vqm3r6-are-covid-death-rates-wildly-inflated.html
@metal-brain saidI prefer not to waste my time in most of your crank threads.
"If anything, the evidence indicates that deaths from COVID were significantly undercounted."
Stop repeating propaganda. I created a whole thread about that and you proved nothing on it.
https://rumble.com/vqm3r6-are-covid-death-rates-wildly-inflated.html
The data I just cited speaks for itself.
2 edits
@no1marauder saidVAERS data is an underestimate since few people report adverse events.
I prefer not to waste my time in most of your crank threads.
The data I just cited speaks for itself.
Why are covid deaths counted differently than vaccine deaths? If you cannot give a good answer you are condoning a double standard. They do not even count the vaccinated without inflating the numbers.
http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=62747
https://rumble.com/vqm3r6-are-covid-death-rates-wildly-inflated.html
CDC data has been corrupted as has been proven to you countless times. Stop lying! The data is corrupted and that makes any statistics using that data corrupted. STOP USING CORRUPTED US DATA!
@metal-brain saidThe US government has been publishing yearly mortality figures for decades; if you want to believe they all of a sudden decided to bump the figure by half a million just so Bill Gates could implant tracking devices in all Americans, be my guest.
VAERS data is an underestimate since few people report adverse events.
Why are covid deaths counted differently than vaccine deaths? If you cannot give a good answer you are condoning a double standard. They do not even count the vaccinated without inflating the numbers.
http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=62747
https://rumble.com/vqm3r6-are-covid-death-rates ...[text shortened]... is corrupted and that makes any statistics using that data corrupted. STOP USING CORRUPTED US DATA!
Just don't expect rational people to "debate" such lunacy.
@shavixmir said===It kills more than 10x more than flu.===
It kills more than 10x more than flu.
But, 9-11 only killed 3000 people, why get your knickers in a twist over that?
However, it’s the hospitalisation rate (if I have to explain this one more time, I’m gonna have to shoot me a republican) which is what has to be controlled.
Unless you've just come in a time machine from March 2020, you should know better than that.
I'm still waiting for one shred of evidence that Omicron is worse than the flu for a fully vaccinated person. (Per capita, please. I don't need useless raw numbers; thank you.)
As a fully vaxxed and boosted person myself, I'll take Omicron over the flu any day of the week and twice on Wednesday.
2 edits
@no1marauder saidAmazing how we "COVID fans" seem to get our way in every western country and at roughly the same times of year.
"Low"? Multiply it by 365 and tell me if it's "low" esp. as compared to the flu, like SH keeps insisting COVID is no worse then.
Sure, deaths trail by a bit but cases are rising again due, in part, to COVID fans like SH getting their way and many States not taking wise precautions (as well as litigation started by right wingers blocking various government health measur ...[text shortened]... It's doubtful deaths will drop in the immediate future esp. with the holidays and indoor gatherings.
In Florida, it was the fault of COVID fans. In New York, where care numbers are sky high, it's apparently also the fault of COVID fans, even though New York has some of the strictest vax and mask rules in the country.
The megalomania of people who think they can control the spread of a highly contagious respiratory virus is mind-numbing.
Even with all the digging in that's human nature, I would have thought the runaway spread of Omicron in blue states would have made it obvious that all the prattle about how the summer spread was the South's fault was nonsense. But I'm underestimating the doggedness of the Branch Covidian faith adherents.
Thankfully, even the Biden White House seems to have conceded this and is not pushing for new lockdowns. Of course, the new testing regime, while relatively low cost, is mostly useless. Omicron will come and go as in its nature, probably similar to the pattern it's showing South Africa and UK. We're probably 4-6 weeks behind SA and maybe 2-4 behind the UK.
But don't worry. In another month, all the vaccine and mask mandates will start working on Omicron. Then you'll be able to crow about how well they work and start talking about how we've defeated COVID. Then in June, when COVID starts increasing in the South, you can join the blue checkmarks in calling Ron DeSantis a murderer again.
Enjoy.