Originally posted by @fmfIf it were primarily about stopping women from having abortions, there were any number Republican presidential candidates available who had much stronger anti-abortion stances.
What's it all about?
Is it just about stopping women from having abortions?
Is that all it is, or is there some other reason for "Christian" fealty to Trump?
If Christianity had the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry as its foundation, then there wouldn't be any Christian Trump supporters. But it isn't, so Christians constitute a large percentage.
Is that all it is, or is there some other reason for "Christian" fealty to Trump?
Misogyny, racism, greed and simple mindedness had no small part in getting Trump elected.
Originally posted by @thinkofoneNot all people who call themselves Christians think abortion is murder.. Suzy is the poster girl for that crowd.
If it were primarily about stopping women from having abortions, there were any number Republican presidential candidates available who had much stronger anti-abortion stances.
If Christianity had the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry as its foundation, then there wouldn't be any Christian Trump supporters. But it isn't, so Christians cons ...[text shortened]... /b]
Misogyny, racism, greed and simple mindedness had no small part in getting Trump elected.
However, Christians that do believe that abortion is murder, it is akin to trying to decide on whether to vote for a Nazi, or their opponent who is against the Holocaust, because the Nazi regime has swell social programs, which they did have. Sure, their opponent could have any number of flaws, but you would have to be hard pressed to find flaws as bad as this. But most people vote their pocket book instead, which the German people did do. In fact, most women have an abortion due to money concerns, and it is a billion dollar industry that helps keep organizations like Planned Parenthood afloat. Considering this, I don't see it being overturned, but does that mean we should still not fight it? I think we have an obligation to fight it if we think it is murder even though the world will reject us, but then again, they will ultimately reject us as Christians anyway. As the Bible says, the root of all evil is the love of money, and if the world rejected Christ, they will do the same to his followers.
It is the choice of political groups like the DNC who have built their political organization on issues such as abortion. There is no room for dissent. Not only do they want It legal, they want taxpayers to fund it. It would be akin to German taxpayers voting to pay for for more ovens.
Now what confuses the hell out of me are organizations like the Catholic church. It is their official position that abortion is murder, but judging from what the Catholic church chooses to focus on instead, and the followers of the religion, you wouldn't think it was. But that is just how Catholics are. They realize that they are basically screwed with doctrines they don't agree with and would be hard pressed to change, so they kinda pretend they don't exist.
As for Republican Presidents saying they want to overturn Roe vs. Wade, if that were true then they would appoint people who were like minded. They don't.
But as a Christian, all you can do is go by what they say.
Shrug.
As the Bible states, the world is desperately wicked along with the various world kingdoms, and judging from the history of genocide in the human race, it would seem that it is just our nature.
The only opposition to it in this world to the mass genocide is a desert God who says that sacrificing children to him is unacceptable, which all ancient religions did prior to the God of the Bible.
My guess is that the deep state has info on Kavanaugh that would suggest that he might try to overturn Roe vs. Wade. If that is the case, chances are he is toast.
Originally posted by @whodeyApart from the abortion issue, why else did (and do) so many Christians support Trump?
Not all people who call themselves Christians think abortion is murder.. Suzy is the poster girl for that crowd.
However, Christians that do believe that abortion is murder, it is akin to trying to decide on whether to vote for a Nazi, or their opponent who is against the Holocaust, because the Nazi regime has swell social programs, which they did have. ...[text shortened]... ggest that he might try to overturn Roe vs. Wade. If that is the case, chances are he is toast.
Originally posted by @fmfAnd to think I just got done explaining it.
It's a serious question. Aside from abortion issue, how do you explain why so many Christians support Trump?
Ok, I will add one other possible explanation since you completely dismissed the first.
As hard as it is to understand, Trump has charisma. Just look at the success of his TV show. I never watched it, nor understood it, but other people enjoyed it.
Keep in mind, that does not mean people like him. In fact, I'm not sure even his kids like him, but he has charisma.
It's an odd combination really, but then, his political opponent was arguably worse in this regard.
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Originally posted by @whodeyOther than you liking his stance on abortion and what you perceive as being his charisma, what other values and policies drove you to vote for Donald Trump?
As hard as it is to understand, Trump has charisma.
Originally posted by @whodeyI am asking specifically: how do you explain why so many Christians support Trump? I am not asking what his retail politics talents are and I am not talking about "The Apprentice". I am asking how do you explain why so many Christians support Trump when you consider his character and behaviour ~ specifically Christians?
And to think I just got done explaining it.
Ok, I will add one other possible explanation since you completely dismissed the first.
As hard as it is to understand, Trump has charisma. Just look at the success of his TV show. I never watched it, nor understood it, but other people enjoyed it.
Keep in mind, that does not mean people like him. In f ...[text shortened]... s an odd combination really, but then, his political opponent was arguably worse in this regard.
As I said:
<<Misogyny, racism, greed and simple mindedness had no small part in getting Trump elected.>>
Based on the responses from whodey and rbhill, it's evident that "simple mindedness" played no small part for them. Perhaps they'll later shed some light on how much the other three also came into play for them.
Originally posted by @fmfFr. Mitch Pacwa said that Catholics cannot vote for anyone who supports abortion, and he furhter stated that it is our duty to fight abortion tooth & nail.
What's it all about?
Is it just about stopping women from having abortions?
Is that all it is, or is there some other reason for "Christian" fealty to Trump?
So, I do know a little old Mexican lady, God bless her, who voted for Trump in spite of disagreeing with him on other issues because she felt that he would further the cause of stopping the murders of the unborn.
So, geez, man, what do you say to that?
"You shouldn't be so passionate about your deeply held beliefs because... it would benefit me?...."
On all seriousness, FMF, here is a list of the most prominent Christian conservative podcast personalities, more or less, and their positions on Trump.
- Fr. Mitch Pacwa (Catholic): He is morally bankrupt but he is a better option than the alternative in many ways.
- James White (Reformed Baptist, Calvinist): He is morally bankrupt but he has the right positions on key issues and so we have to just choose the lesser of two evils.
- Fr. Josian Trenham (Orthodox): He is morally bankrupt, but he is pro-life and he is actually willing to combat a lot of cultural Leftism, so we should generally support him even though he isn't our first choice.
- Albert Mohler (Southern Baptist Convention): Can never vote for Hillary; contemplated voting for Pres. Trump, but advised every listener to not vote for President Trump even if he says the right things because he is totally morally bankrupt, and it'll make Christians look bad for supporting him and resorting to a sort of shallow pragmatism (probably much in agreement with you, FMF).
Sadly, I did not get anyuthing from Fr. Patrick Henry Rearden (Orthodox). He never commented beyond remarking a few times that both candidates are jokes.
I am sure there were Christians who said other things, but they were not prominent conservative Christians so I do not know.
But this list is here to show you one thing & one thing only:
The most conservative Christian personalities who have listeners in the hundreds of thousands who are hardcore Christian political junkies all had very nuanced beliefs and not a single one of them unreservedly endorsed the President.
Your simple narrative is not adequate nor representative of conservatives.
Originally posted by @divegeesterIn a college paper, Barak Obama expressed some hero worship for Donald Trump because of his financial success stating that he wanted to be as successful as well as his children.
Other than you liking his stance on abortion and what you perceive as being his charisma, what other values and policies drove you to vote for Donald Trump?
I think many people feel the same.