@rajk999said Faith is confidence or trust . Atheists trust, or are confident, that there is no God
Words like faith have more than one usage. It can mean confidence in something or belief in the spiritual. Atheism doesn't fall into the latter, meaning it is not a faith.
@rajk999said Faith is confidence or trust . Atheists trust, or are confident, that there is no God, I know there is a big argument about this but its really a petty one. What is the correct thing to say then?
Perhaps something like "openly declare their Atheism".
In politics, the argument of, "if they were confident in their belief, they would say it out loud", ignores the fact that politics is very much about getting votes, which heavily relies on telling people what they want to hear [and avoiding saying that which people do not want to hear].
Show me a politician that always speaks with full confidence in their own beliefs, and I'll show you one who doesn't win elections.
@kevcvs57said Given their obvious divergence on personal morality issues the most apt way to describe the relationship between Trump and conservative / evangelical Christians is an open eyed symbiosis.
Christianity existed before Pres. Trump, and will exist after Pres. Trump.
Christianity does not take cues from the American President.
"Franklin Graham, Pence Lead Prayer March Thanking God for Trump"
Franklin Graham is the son of Billy Graham.
They prayed for the President at the 2020 Prayer march.
Graham joined former Republican congresswoman Michelle Bachmann and Pence in declaring, "Our country is in trouble, and only God can fix the problems" faced by the United States. The trio led thousands of attendees at Saturday's 2020 Prayer March event just hours before Trump is set to announce his nominee to fill the vacancy created following Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg's death on Sept. 18. Bachmann called on God to "bind this president's minions" and secure a second Trump term in the upcoming November elections.
Graham, who is head of the humanitarian Samaritan's Purse organization, asked the thousands of attendees to bow their heads as "we pray today specifically for the president, Donald J. Trump."
@philokaliasaid Christianity existed before Pres. Trump, and will exist after Pres. Trump.
Christianity does not take cues from the American President.
Can I assume you don’t agree that the relationship between Trump and conservative US Christians is more symbiotic than an active alliance based on shared values real or imagined.
@kevcvs57said Can I assume you don’t agree that the relationship between Trump and conservative US Christians is more symbiotic than an active alliance based on shared values real or imagined.
They are far more comfortable following Trump and making excuses for his behavior while pretending to follow Jesus than they are actually following Jesus.
This is why Trump is their 'White Jesus'. According to them, he's come to save them from people not like them.
@suziannesaid They are far more comfortable following Trump and making excuses for his behavior while pretending to follow Jesus than they are actually following Jesus.
This is why Trump is their 'White Jesus'. According to them, he's come to save them from people not like them.
I wonder if they’ve forgotten the old adage “if you sup with the devil be sure to use a long spoon”. They might not appreciate the backlash against their values that arises from them using someone like trump to thrust them onto unwilling citizens.
They are literally riding the whore of Babylon.
@rajk999said The USA is God-fearing nation built on principles of Christianity. Americans should not be afraid to promote the words of the Pledge of Allegiance. If atheists are shy about promoting their atheist faith, then the only reasonable conclusion is that they are unsure of their belief.
I protest. After a thousand years of popes crowning kings, kings ruling by divine right, and state religions, America was founded on secular humanist principles, not Christian ones. The separation of church and state enshrined in the U.S. Constitution and BoR was absolutely not a Christian principle. Don't forget that the queen is not only the head of state, but also the head of the Anglican Church. The reason why that isn't so in America is a secular humanist principle, not a Christian one.
Americans are free to leave out the "under God" bit of the pledge. "Freedom of religion" also means "freedom from religion."
@philokaliasaid I've posted on this before... But I don't know Christians saying that, and rather, I listen to a lot of conservative Christian podcasts, and there's a tidy list of people I can tell you right now who condemn his personal life but are supporting his political positions...
Fr. Josiah Trenham (Orthodox)
Fr. Mitch Pacwa (Catholic)
James White (Presbyterian)
Michael Brown (Baptist)
Al Mohler (Baptist)
The list goes on.
There is something hypocritical about condemning Trump's personal life and supporting his political position. I recall when Sen. Gary Hart's presidential campaign was terminated by a photograph of a pretty woman (not his wife) sitting on his lap. Whatever Hart's political position was, the presumed impropriety of his private life was enough to ruin his career. Why is it different for Trump, whose private improprieties are worse, more numerous, and smugly paraded before the public, than those of Hart's?
In one respect, conservative Christians are right that America has undergone a moral decline in recent decades. Thing is, they are wrong about which end of the spectrum is sagging. The hypocrisy of right-wing Trump supporters is staggering.
@moonbussaid I protest. After a thousand years of popes crowning kings, kings ruling by divine right, and state religions, America was founded on secular humanist principles, not Christian ones. The separation of church and state enshrined in the U.S. Constitution and BoR was absolutely not a Christian principle. Don't forget that the queen is not only the head of state, but also the head ...[text shortened]... the "under God" bit of the pledge. "Freedom of religion" also means "freedom from religion."
Most countries now have that principle enshrined in their respective constitutions. In practice it is not easy to apply, and rewording the Pledge of Allegiance would offend more than not offend. An extreme case is that of India who has for a couple centuries included in their constitution that principle but even today has found it difficult to keep the state out of the affairs of the temples. This is why Trump is likely to win. The man is a very bad example of just about everything under the sun but he supports Christianity. On that alone he will win in my opinion. The USA is a country built on Christian principles regardless what the constitution says.
21 Oct '20 22:53
Christians Know Trump is Holy
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