@kellyjay saidSo, yes or no. You say being gay is a choice. Could you choose to be gay?
If we are made that way then there are no choices, if there are choices can we say we were made that way? If we were made that way, and there really is a right way we were made, and even than we find we still have choices, can we choose to be something other than the way we were meant to be made?
The truth of all of this, is there a real proper answer for this? If there i ...[text shortened]... breaking away from that will be wrong no matter what choices are made outside of the makers intent.
@fmf saidSometimes it can just be silence.
Sometimes silence does speak volumes. Not always, but sometimes it is intellectual cowardice. Other times it can be tacit endorsement.
Three people in a room. Two are arguing vehemently. They both suddenly stop and accuse the third person (who's only listening) of supporting their opponent. Who's right? Neither one. Both have no confidence in their own argument and think if they can kowtow the third person into agreeing with them, the argument can be won. Those who do this are no better than children.
@suzianne saidYou ever thought of trying that with me? With a lot of what you post that's addressed to me, you sell yourself short and cut a rather Trumpian figure.
Sometimes it can just be silence.
If what I contribute is truly as awful and hateful and as eviscerating as you have been claiming for years and years, surely other posters would pick up on it without you devoting - some months - up to 80-90% of your SF posts to it, by - first and foremost dodging the topic in hand and whatever point I have made - and then telling me that my posts are so very awful and so full of "hate" etc. etc ad nauseam.
Sometimes your response could just be silence instead, and my supposed very, very, very, very awfulness would speak for itself and I would be condemned by my own behaviour. Just a thought.
@kellyjay saidShould other people restrain their desires, due to going against 'your' beliefs and conscience. Should they be made to feel guilty and undergo 'conversion therapy' due to going against 'your' beliefs and conscience?
I could choose to do whatever I want, and in addition I can restrain myself too. Having a desire doesn’t mean I should act on it, especially if It goes against my beliefs and conscience.
Interesting though to hear you could choose to be gay if you so wanted.
@fmf saidA reboot of the statement:
A reboot of the OP question, just in case anyone still wants to address it:
If you are opposed to reducing or eliminating discrimination against homosexuals, [based on your beliefs] what types of discrimination would you support?
Because we do not believe that marriage can ever consist between two men (or two women), and because we tend to believe in the primacy of the right to free association, we don't actually believe in anything that remotely resembles the loaded words of "discrimination."
Rather, we believe that marriage is marriage.
And, we also believe that property owners should not be forced to honor things that go against their religious (or political beliefs) by law. It's their right to only use their property as they see fit.
Phrasing the question in the way that you have is obtuse and misses the point.
@philokalia saidIf you are opposed to reducing or eliminating discrimination against two men or two women getting married, what types of discrimination against them by society and the government would you support?
Because we do not believe that marriage can ever consist between two men (or two women), and because we tend to believe in the primacy of the right to free association, we don't actually believe in anything that remotely resembles the loaded words of "discrimination."
@philokalia saidWhat action do you believe society or the government should take - if any - against people who believe "marriage" is also between men and men, and women and women, and who just want to go ahead and enter into a "marriage" of that kind?
we believe that marriage is marriage.
@ghost-of-a-duke saidIf we are the single measure of rights and wrongs why not? If we are not then no matter what we say, do, acknowledge, ignore, agree or disagree about no, it will only matter how we line up our lives with that truth!
Should other people restrain their desires, due to going against 'your' beliefs and conscience. Should they be made to feel guilty and undergo 'conversion therapy' due to going against 'your' beliefs and conscience?
Interesting though to hear you could choose to be gay if you so wanted.
@kellyjay saidThere isn't a "single measure" of right or wrong about homosexuality, unless - that is - with the phrase "the single measure of right and wrong", you are referring to your own personal opinion about homosexuality, i. e. that it is "wrong".
If we are the single measure of rights and wrongs why not?