Eternal One

Originally posted by @eladar
Your words...

If God forces all of our choices on us then punishes us for those choices He made for us,
that would be evil in my opinion.

True I said that, but that isn't God, that is you.

Originally posted by @sonship
Hanah had the sense that God had a need.
Would you believe that ?

If she thought that God needs nothing, she would not have asked for a son to lend to Jehovah.

Let's come up to the [b]New Testament. In John 15 the true Vine Christ and the abiding branches, the disciples form one organic entity. That is the Vine and its branches are nee ...[text shortened]... eds to be glorified through the entire organism of the true vine and the branches bearing fruit.[/b]

No still, God does not need us, but He loves us, which in my opinion is much stronger.

Acts 2:23
This man was handed over to you by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross.

1 Peter 1:2
who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood: Grace and peace be yours in abundance.

Foreknowledge is different than forcing someone not allowing them to have choice or
will in the matter.

Originally posted by @kellyjay

No still, God does not need us, but He loves us, which in my opinion is much stronger.

The True Vine and the branches are needed by God to accomplish something for His will.
God can do some things unilaterally and alone. But He will not do it that way.
Since God intentionally limits Himself in some matters to have a man on the earth correspond to His desire, in that sense God needs man.

God could have destroyed Satan unilaterally the moment he rebelled. He chose to wait until another of His creations - man, willingly agrees, willingly cooperates, willingly coordinates to put down this enemy.

In that sense God needs man.
God has put Himself in the position of needing man.

Did God need Christ to be incarnated as a man ?
Did God need this Man to live a sinless life on the earth ?
Did God need for this Man to die and obedient death to accomplish eternal redemption ?

Did God need the man Christ Jesus to drink the cup of His will in justifying sinners ?
God did need to raise Christ that He would be the Mediator and Executor of a new covenant.
God did need Christ to lead many sons into glory.

Look at Christ in His prayer before His going to the cross.

" Again, going away a second time, He prayed, saying, My Father, if this cannot pass away unless I drink it, Your will be done." (Matt. 26:42)

Didn't Jesus realize that His Father had a need for Him to drink the cup of wrath for our justification, redemption and salvation ?

In God's love for us He needed to maintain His righteous standard that sin be judged.
If God had absolutely no need at all then He would just forget about our redemption and uphold His righteousness that every sinner be lost under His judgment.

" And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us ... " (John 1:14a)

Did God have a need for the Word Who was God to become flesh ?

"... the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)

Did God have a need for the last Adam Who was God incarnate to become a life giving Spirit ?

To redeem man and to come into man God has a need for Christ.
And Christ has a need for a Body, the church.

Originally posted by @sonship

No still, God does not need us, but He loves us, which in my opinion is much stronger.

The True Vine and the branches are needed by God to accomplish something for His will.
God can do some things unilaterally and alone. But He will not do it that way.
Since God intentionally limits Himself in some matters to have a man on the earth ...[text shortened]... about our redemption and uphold His righteousness that every sinner be lost under His judgment.

We are the branches that need the Vine, we need God, each and everyone of us.
God can do anything, with or without us, what He wants to do is use us, that isn't a need on His part.
God choosing to work with us isn't a need on His part.
You need something it means you ate not complete without, God spent eternity past fine
without us and I'm quite sure He could have continued the same way throughout all of
time too, had He desired too. He does not need us, He wants us.

You are going on about the things God has chosen to do as if, if He didn't, He would suffer
for it in that He needs it, like we need food and water. That is not the case.

Originally posted by @sonship

[b] " And the Word became flesh and tabernacled among us ... " (John 1:14a)

Did God have a need for the Word Who was God to become flesh ?

"... the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)

Did God have a need for the last Adam Who was God incarnate to become a life giving Spirit ?

...[text shortened]... n and to come into man God has a need for Christ.
And Christ has a need for a Body, the church.[/b]

You are looking at our needs, and suggesting God had a need. God's grace was started
to be poured out as soon as Adam and Eve ate of that fruit. He could have wiped them
out, that struggle between those angels that remained loyal and those that followed Satan
did not end that way with grace. Instead that war poured out onto the earth and now we
are involved since we took a side against God.

God's plan of redemption isn't done because God NEEDED to do it, He did it out of His
love for us, the restraint He shows and gives us keeping us free to make our own choices
are not needs of HIS, but due to our needs.

What God is doing with us, becoming one of us shows us His grace and mercy is such a
powerful thing, that Jesus actually became sin for us was not because Jesus needed to
be sin, He was in perfect fellowship with God and had been forever. He didn't need that,
but His obedience to God and His love for us brought Him here to do what He did.

So suggesting that God needed isn't showing us God who is the great I am needed. It
simply shows us how far God was willing to go to save us out of love. God didn't need
a body or a church, but He loves us and was willing to do what it took to make us that.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
True I said that, but that isn't God, that is you.

OK, you are simply blind.

Either you are blind or not intelligent enough to understand the concept.

The concept is that no matter how God acts, God is good because God defines good.

I guess you need to be who you are so you can't help but claim to believe the concept but be a hypocrite in application.

Originally posted by @eladar
OK, you are simply blind.

Either you are blind or not intelligent enough to understand the concept.

The concept is that no matter how God acts, God is good because God defines good.

I guess you need to be who you are so you can't help but claim to believe the concept but be a hypocrite in application.

God is good, you are not, and neither am I. So when you tell how you define God, I am worried about about disagreeing with how you define God, I find that god evil. Your version of God closely resembles you, not the God within scripture.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
God is good, you are not, and neither am I. So when you tell how you define God, I am worried about about disagreeing with how you define God, I find that god evil. Your version of God closely resembles you, not the God within scripture.

Is God good because he is God or is God good based on how you believe he acts?

Originally posted by @eladar
Is God good because he is God or is God good based on how you believe he acts?

God is good, I am not. The because does not matter, His ways are not mine. I trust Him, not you.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
God is good, I am not. The because does not matter, His ways are not mine. I trust Him, not you.

The because does matter. It reflects what is actually in your heart.

Your heart tells you that man really judges God because how God acts determines if God is good or not.

Originally posted by @eladar
The because does matter. It reflects what is actually in your heart.

Your heart tells you that man really judges God because how God acts determines if God is good or not.

That why you degrade Jesus' name?

Originally posted by @kellyjay
That why you degrade Jesus' name?

That is why you believe I denigrate Jesus' name.

You don't know the difference between God's truth and Satan's lies. You think that societal values are from God.

Originally posted by @eladar
The because does matter. It reflects what is actually in your heart.

Your heart tells you that man really judges God because how God acts determines if God is good or not.

I told you God is good, that His ways are higher than mine. I believe in Him even when I don't understand, so for me it doesn't matter. When things are going well and when things are not, so again, the because does not matter.

If it matters to you then are you suggesting you may not approve of God for some reason?