Fabians View

Originally posted by ahosyney
Let me ask you what religon is for. And whay do you think human need religon.

Evolutionary, I think man has had religion from the dawn of human race, perhaps also before. It is well inside of us and a part of our psykology.

But this doesn't mean that we have to have a religion. We can easaly be without it. We're living in the 21st century. The earth is not still flat and we know a lot of universe and nature.

What it is for? To explain the things that is thought not to be explainable.
Why do we need religion? To have a sence of security of evil things. Like children need comfort from their parents.
Short answers, perhaps not well thought of yet.

Originally posted by rwingett
Nothing you have said here contradicts anything from my previous post. Whether there are 6 religions or 6 billion is irrelevant. Many of them deserve no respect at all, but none of them is worthy of wholehearted respect.

You are entitle to your opinion.
If it differs somewhat from mine, doesn't trouble me.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
The earth is not still flat and we know a lot of universe and nature.

People have known the earth isn't flat for nearly a thousand years (if not more).

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Short answers, perhaps not well thought of yet.

On that we are in complete agreement.

Originally posted by lucifershammer
[b]I belive in the principle that every one is entitle to be respected for their religion - if - they equally respect others views of their religion.

What does that mean, precisely?

In religion truth does not exist, only faith.

If it is not about Truth, then it's pointless.[/b]

I take the truth part first.

You spell truth with a capital T. In my terminology it stands for the ultimate Truth. this one we now nothing about. Truth with a small t is the truth I believe in, and in your view the one you believe in. The two doesn't have to be the same, the can co work perfectly. Like two people se the same elephant. One sees the tail, the other sees the trunk and yet both see the same elephant.

To think that you know the Truth is pompous. It is not possible. Religion is to believe that he sees the Truth and believe it is the fact. The humbleness come from the fact that he let others see their Truth and let they believe that it is the fact. The very Truth itself cannot anyone know.

So religion is not about truth, nor Truth, only that you believe that it is true enough.

You want me to elaborate the question of religious respect further? Well, it would take much more space and dialogue for me to know if i am on the right track. I don't have the Truth, you know. I can only point of my view in the matter. I hope it has been sufficiently clear as it is. Please be more specific what you don't understand.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Evolutionary, I think man has had religion from the dawn of human race, perhaps also before. It is well inside of us and a part of our psykology.

But this doesn't mean that we have to have a religion. We can easaly be without it. We're living in the 21st century. The earth is not still flat and we know a lot of universe and nature.

What it is for? T ...[text shortened]... ike children need comfort from their parents.
Short answers, perhaps not well thought of yet.

I think it is all about GOD existance.

If you belive that GOD exist and GOD created you and one day he will ask you about your life. So religon come to answer the question, what GOD wants from us.

Religon is the manual for human life. Manufacture of an appliance know the best operating rules to operate a device and write that in the Manual. GOD as a creator for humans knows the best for human and he tell us that through the religon.

So if there is only one GOD then there will be only one way for GOD. This way is the religon you want to know, and follow.


If you belive that GOD is not there why do you worry about anything. Why do you need religon for.

Originally posted by lucifershammer

People have known the earth isn't flat for nearly a thousand years (if not more).

Since the experiment of Eratosthenes from the year 250 BC (!) when he in Alexandria measured the earths radius to the true value of 40 000 kilometer. After that the Christian Popes deny everything else than the earth was flat until Columbus proved it otherwise.

On that we are in complete agreement.

Perhaps short answers is the way to deal with hard questions where true answers don’t exist.

Originally posted by ahosyney
I think it is all about GOD existance.

If you belive that GOD exist and GOD created you and one day he will ask you about your life. So religon come to answer the question, what GOD wants from us.

Religon is the manual for human life. Manufacture of an appliance know the best operating rules to operate a device and write that in the Manual. GOD as a ...[text shortened]... f you belive that GOD is not there why do you worry about anything. Why do you need religon for.

There are atheistic religions. They, too, deserves respect as religions.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
There are atheistic religions. They, too, deserves respect as religions.

This is a big confusion. I will try to restate my idea

What will happen after you die. Is this the end or is there another life.

Most religons talks about the after life and there will be heaven or hill. Heaven for the follower of GOD way and Hill for others. So if you belive in that the GOD way is the only way you go the heaven.

That is what religon is all about.

So if you belive in the after life you have to worry about which religon is the true one. If not all religons are the same.

Originally posted by liteswordatlitespeed
I feel that we have no boundaries [b]according to our solar system. However I am not sure how far beyond it we can expand. If the... *cough* Great Being *cough*...wanted us to know about things outside our solar system, would he not have shown us after eight-ten thousand years (or however long you think the earth has been around for)?[/b]

This is a continuation of the Thread 53277

Well, we can call him God for a while...
But he is giving us information about the universe, from the big Bang itself, he is a generous God, isn’t he? He reveal everything about his creation, from the tiniest particles, to the grandeur of the universe itself , and also in a pace of our technology can handle. There are questions still to be answered but eventually we get them too. We just have to be mature enough to understand them.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
After that the Christian Popes deny everything else than the earth was flat until Columbus proved it otherwise.

You really need to learn your history:

"The common misconception that people, especially the Christian Church, before the age of exploration believed that Earth was flat entered the popular imagination after Washington Irving's publication of The Life and Voyages of Christopher Columbus in 1828. In the United States, this belief persists in the popular imagination, and is even repeated in some widely read textbooks. ... During the 19th century, the Romantic conception of a European "Dark Age" gave much more prominence to the Flat Earth model than it ever possessed historically."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth#Modern_times


If you're going to diss Christianity, the least you can do is get your facts straight.

The Big Bang...


who said that the universe was created by a Big Bang?

The Bible just says "God created..."

Never says how he created, so you already assume too much.

(edit- Fabian I thank you for creating this.)

Originally posted by FabianFnas
I take the truth part first.

You spell truth with a capital T. In my terminology it stands for the ultimate Truth. this one we now nothing about. Truth with a small t is the truth I believe in, and in your view the one you believe in. The two doesn't have to be the same, the can co work perfectly. Like two people se the same elephant. One sees the tail ...[text shortened]... ow.

So religion is not about truth, nor Truth, only that you believe that it is true enough.

john 8:32

"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free."

This word "truth", in the Greek, can be correlated to the word "truth used in John 14:6 "For I am the way, the truth, and the life. Noone may come to the father except through me."

Therefore, from that derivation, it is possible to know the Truth!

😏😏😏

(edit-sorry for the double-post, guys.)

Originally posted by FabianFnas
I take the truth part first.

You spell truth with a capital T. In my terminology it stands for the ultimate Truth. this one we now nothing about. Truth with a small t is the truth I believe in, and in your view the one you believe in. The two doesn't have to be the same, the can co work perfectly. Like two people se the same elephant. One sees the tail ...[text shortened]... e it has been sufficiently clear as it is. Please be more specific what you don't understand.

I think you avoided LH's point. What is the purpose of religion if it is not about absolute truth?

Originally posted by FabianFnas
This is a continuation of the Thread 53277

Well, we can call him God for a while...
But he is giving us information about the universe, from the big Bang itself, he is a generous God, isn’t he? He reveal everything about his creation, from the tiniest particles, to the grandeur of the universe itself , and also in a pace of our technolo ...[text shortened]... be answered but eventually we get them too. We just have to be mature enough to understand them.

I thought you said ultimate truth was unknowable? You say that one day man will know all there is to know about everything. Unfortunatly for us, it seems that the more knowledge we obtain the more questions are generated from such knowledge. Assuming you are right and man will one day reach the pinnacle of knowledge, what then? Who cares? Enjoy such knowledge while you can. After all, your life is but a vapor. Once you die all such knowledge/truth will be nothing more than pure vainity.

This reminds me of a scripture which is Ecclesiastes 1:13. It says,

"And I gave my heart to seek and search out by wisdom concerning all things that are done under heaven; this sore travail has God given to the sons of man to be exercised therewith. I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all is vanity and vexation of spirit. That which is crooked cannot be made straight; and that which is wanting cannot be numbered. I communed with mine own heart, saying, Lo, I am come to great estate, and have gotten more wisdom than all they that have been before me in Jerusalem; yea, my heart had great experience of widsom and knowledge. And I gave my heart to know wisdom, and to know madness and folly; I perceived that this is also vexation of spirit. For in much wisdom is much grief; and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."

It seems that with increased knowledge comes increased burden according to the scripture. As you begin to percieve the universe for what it actually is the more you realize how insignificant you are in comparison to it and the futility of fighting such an insignificance existence due to your finite and temperal state. What good does it all really due you other than create a sense of hoplessness and increased worry?

Do you find it odd that we hunger and thirst after this so called Ultimate truth, when in reality, we are unable to come to such an Ultimate truth by ourselves? We also seem to hungering and thirsting after this ultimate knowledge which, in fact, seems to bring nothing but vexation of spirit according to the above scripture. It is, in fact, a bit paradoxical don't you think?

Considering these facts, this tells me one thing. This tells me that we are designed to hunger and thirst after this Ultimate Truth, however, we were never designed to receive the burden of the totality of this Ultimate Truth. Instead, we were designed to want to only commune with this Ultimate Truth. God is the Ultimate truth and we are designed to seek him.