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@wolfgang59 saidWould "enough" be that God force you to believe against your will ?
Apparently not enough.
Would "enough" be for God to violate your free will and coerce you to be saved despite your wanting not to be ?
@stellspalfie saidIt’s in scripture, do a word study on “God” and “hate” you don’t have to take my word for this.
Does God choose to hate?
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If we are going to talk about what God hates, we should realize what He hates the most.
What God hates the most is death.
Death is called "the last enemy" .
For He must reign until He puts all His enemies under His feet. The last enemy that is being abolished is death. (1 Cor. 15:25,26)
God hates sin and unrighteousness.
" ... Your throne, O God, is forever and ever ... You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness ..." (See Hebrews 1:8,9)
I think He hares death more. The very last and most insidious enemy of God is death. That includes spiritual death of being separated from Himself as the uncreated and eternal divine life.
The last enemy that is being abolished is death.
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@kellyjay saidWhile God is love, He is also just, and good these are also two things that
Our warped view of God is love is what people use to think that its all going to be
okay. While God is love, He is also just, and good these are also two things that
are true and will never stop being true. As a good God will forever hate the wicked,
the evil, sinners, and will not accept them as these all fall short.
I heard a sermon the other day that really p ...[text shortened]... il we do keep us
from acknowledging Him for who He is, and loving God and each other as we
should.
are true and will never stop being true. As a good God will forever hate the wicked, the evil, sinners, and will not accept them as these all fall short.
Let's see.
On one hand, God forever hates " the wicked, the evil, sinners, and will not accept them".
On the other hand God loves and accepts "salvation by faith alone" Christians despite the fact that history shows that they continue to sin and by and large are as wicked and evil as non-Christians.
Seems it is your "view of God" is what is "warped".
How can anyone reasonably hold such nonsensical beliefs? You just mindlessly regurgitate the dogma that has been taught to you.
@sonship saidI don’t doubt He hates death, but I think the root cause of what brought death into the human condition He hates more. That being sin, evil, and wickedness that caused us to be put in this position. Which is why those that are given to them will not be entering His Kingdom after judgment.
If we are going to talk about what God hates, we should realize what He hates the most.
What God hates the most is death.
Death is called "the last enemy" .For He must reign until He puts all His enemies under His feet. The last enemy that is being abolished is death. (1 Cor. 15:25,26)
God hates sin and unrighteousness.
[quote] " ...[text shortened]... the uncreated and eternal divine life.
The last enemy that is being abolished is death.
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I don’t doubt He hates death, but I think the root cause of what brought death into the human condition He hates more.
I think you have a good point in that Romans 5:12 says sin entered and death through sin. I cannot argue against that it says Adam sinned and death then entered into the world.
But in Christian experience it is easier to see that God hates my evil doing.
But it is not easy to see that He could hate my good doing also if it is apart from Him, apart from His life.
Man was placed before to trees in the garden.
The tree of life and "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil".
See Genesis 2:9.
The tree of life brings divine life.
The tree of the knowledge of good and evil brings death.
Notice that both EVIL and GOOD are on the same tree which brings DEATH.
Notice that the revelation of the Bible puts the knowledge of GOOD and EVIL as opposed to LIFE.
Let me ask you this. Why do you think Genesis did not say that there were two trees one- - a tree of the knowledge of good, and two - a tree of the knowledge of evil ?
Why do you think the initial choice for man is between knowing GOOD and knowing EVIL rather than the knowledge of GOOD AND EVIL being on one tree, which brings in DEATH ?
Your thoughts?
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The source which brings in DEATH to man is called "the knowledge of good and evil".
These two knowledges are on one tree - "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil" . Adam was forbidden to eat of it.
The other tree was OKAY for him to eat - "the tree of life".
Genesis 2:9 -
"And out of the ground Jehovah God caused to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, as well as the tree of life in the middle of the garden and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
Genesis 2:16,17 -
And Jehovah God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden you may eat freely.
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, of it you shall not eat; for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.
Question to anyone serious:
Why didn't God tell man he could have the GOOD off of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, but not the EVIL?
Both the knowledge of GOOD AND EVIL were on the same tree that would cause man to DIE.
Have you noticed this or contemplated this?
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The grand leader of all independent beings from God is Satan the Devil - the Daystar - Lucifer.
God has arranged that all rebellious beings and all independent angels, demons, and humans withdrawing from the Creator would be subsumed under one repository - Satan.
Satan no doubt became very evil with he withdrawal from God.
But he probably started out being very good.
The Bible says the Anointed Cherub who became the Devil was originally perfect in wisdom. His evil was opposed to God. Yet his good was opposed to God more subtly.
Both were hated by the God of uncreated and eternal divine life.
Man arrives on the scene of creation with two WAYS from which to choose -
Life of God or the Knowledge of Good and Evil as independent from God.
The latter is of DEATH, the most hated and last enemy of God.
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@kellyjay saidI was looking for your opinion.
It’s in scripture, do a word study on “God” and “hate” you don’t have to take my word for this.
@sonship saidIt was disobeying God that brought death. The issues in play were not that God wanted to keep that information from us, but how and when we were to learn. God knew all about them, but when Adam and Eve ate they became aware through experience, which meant that knowledge became apart of their and our makeup the good and evil.
@KellyJayI don’t doubt He hates death, but I think the root cause of what brought death into the human condition He hates more.
I think you have a good point in that Romans 5:12 says sin entered and death through sin. I cannot argue against that it says Adam sinned and death then entered into the world.
But in Christian experience it is e ...[text shortened]... r than the knowledge of GOOD AND EVIL being on one tree, which brings in DEATH ?
Your thoughts?
We keep things from our kids until we think they are ready.
@stellspalfie saidOkay sorry, when I get home I will write something up for you.
I was looking for your opinion.
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@kellyjay saidDon't worry too much, to be honest I was going to be a smart arse (ass) and make a argument about the nature of God meaning that he would be unable to feel hate without consciously deciding to first and there is something weird about somebody who consciously decides to feel hate.
Okay sorry, when I get home I will write something up for you.