god: the lost years

Originally posted by sonship

Jesus, by and large, seems a much nicer bloke, but he is clearly incompatible with the OT God, and is why you needed people to come up with ever more artful reasons to explain away the contradiction.

If God did not reveal His just hatred for sins in the Old Testament we would not have the backround to appreciate that Christ came and bor ...[text shortened]... pels proving that God's attitude had not changed in His vehemence against unrighteousness.

As I said, artful.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Noah was a preacher of righteousness for forty years, he built an ark, four stories high and about the same length and breadth as a soccer field! Clearly the worlds communities were much smaller then and it takes no great leap of the imagination that people everywhere would have heard of it.

So the Bible does not say that everyone on earth was warned. You have just made that assumption.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
why? can you cite a single example where God arbitrarily executed divine justice upon anyone without giving them prior warning and seeking their repentance? No neither can I.

oooh so its okay to be a mass murderer if you pre-warn your victims. thats what you seem to be saying.

Originally posted by Rank outsider
So the Bible does not say that everyone on earth was warned. You have just made that assumption.

And where does Noah warn people to repent of their sins in order to be saved?

Building a big boat is clearly a sign that he thinks a flood is coming, but where does he or God:

1) Warn everyone it is coming because of sinfulness?

2) Indicate that, if they repent of this sinfulness, they can be saved?

Originally posted by Rank outsider
As I said, artful.

Artful ? What do you mean ?

Originally posted by Rank outsider
And where does Noah warn people to repent of their sins in order to be saved?

Building a big boat is clearly a sign that he thinks a flood is coming, but where does he or God:

1) Warn everyone it is coming [b]because of sinfulness?

2) Indicate that, if they repent of this sinfulness, they can be saved?[/b]

And where does Noah warn people to repent of their sins in order to be saved?

The New Testament says Noah was a preacher of righteousness (2 Pet. 2:5).
I assume he was preaching for those years he was building the ark.

Also "Methusaleh" had a name which means something like "When he dies it will come". This was the child of Enoch who walked with God and was taken - disappeared in some sort of divine rapture.

Now the name of Enoch's son being "When he dies it will come" must refer to the flood of Noah which came when Methusaleh just died. I think we can gather from this that warning of coming judgment was known in that society.

Besides, God is just.

Building a big boat is clearly a sign that he thinks a flood is coming, but where does he or God:

1) Warn everyone it is coming because of sinfulness?

I tried to give evidence for this warning above.

In Bible study first you learn to read the lines carefully. Then you learn to read between the lines, so to speak.

2) Indicate that, if they repent of this sinfulness, they can be saved?

The previous story of Enoch, who walked with God demonstrates to what LENGTH God would go to rescue the righteous man. Enoch walked, I believe 200 years, with God. He must have known what was coming by way of revelation. And consequently he learned to walk step by step with God.

God raptured Enoch out of the earth before the flood. I do not say they all would have been raptured. I do say the story of Enoch just before the flood story suggests God's eagerness to do what He would do to save the repentant man walking with God rather than going along with the trend of the world.

You read the lines. You read the lines together carefully.
Then you learn to read between the lines, so to speak.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Christ was a Hebrew, he upheld the Mosaic Law and instructed others to do likewise.

I see no contradiction.

How are you upholding the Mosaic Law to stone adulterers to death?

Originally posted by sonship

And where does Noah warn people to repent of their sins in order to be saved?

The New Testament says Noah was a preacher of righteousness [b](2 Pet. 2:5).
I assume he was preaching for those years he was building the ark.

Also "Methusaleh" had a name which means something like "When he dies it will come". Th d the lines together carefully.
Then you learn to read between the lines, so to speak.[/b]

So Noah had the time to build the Ark and also travel the globe warning people about the impending doom?

Originally posted by Proper Knob
So Noah had the time to build the Ark and also travel the globe warning people about the impending doom?

I do not know what constituted "the world" in Noah's time.

I write here and things are read over the world without me traveling.
Longevity of life, technology of which we know little of ?
There are too many possibilities to make this a serious show stopper, I think.

Originally posted by sonship

And where does Noah warn people to repent of their sins in order to be saved?

The New Testament says Noah was a preacher of righteousness [b](2 Pet. 2:5).
I assume he was preaching for those years he was building the ark.

Also "Methusaleh" had a name which means something like "When he dies it will come". Th ...[text shortened]... the lines together carefully.
Then you learn to read between the lines, so to speak.[/b]

There is nothing you have quoted to support the view that everyone on earth was warned and given a chance to repent.

You have simply made the assumption, like robbie.

Everything else you quoted was not relevant to the question I asked.

Originally posted by Rank outsider
There is nothing you have quoted to support the view that everyone on earth was warned and given a chance to repent.

You have simply made the assumption, like robbie.

Everything else you quoted was not relevant to the question I asked.

There is nothing you have quoted to support the view that everyone on earth was warned and given a chance to repent.

You have simply made the assumption, like robbie.

Everything else you quoted was not relevant to the question I asked.

I only indicated that there was preaching, warning, and example.
Every single last detail of every single person involved ? No. I don't know.

Are you going to get hung up on that and miss the major theme of the account ?

How did Christ refer to the story ? He used in in terms of warning the existing and coming generations.

Are you really going to hunt for a gnat and swallow the camel on this ?

Last night I read a verse " I will punish the world for its evil, and the wicked for their initquity " (Isaiah 13:11)

Occasionally, I think we need to get the point and not be destracted with hunting for microscopic loopholes of rationalization why we shouldn't listen to God's word.

Originally posted by sonship
Artful ? What do you mean ?

I mean that the interpretation is skewed to fit preconceived perceptions, rather than taken and analysed at face value.

For example, the fact that a super-powerful entity capable of creating life is, by definition, good, irrespective of how it behaves.

If God had never said anything against adultery, and I went around stoning women to death for it, you would have thought I was mass murdering psychopath, as you are a good person who (but for God's word) would have worked out by yourself that it is an abhorrent and despicable thing to do, which has no basis is a civilised world.

The next day, however, God comes along and imposes Mosaic Law, all of a sudden I am one of the righteous, and you would be queuing up behind me stone in hand.

Originally posted by Rank outsider
I mean that the interpretation is skewed to fit preconceived perceptions, rather than taken and analysed at face value.

For example, the fact that a super-powerful entity capable of creating life is, by definition, good, irrespective of how it behaves.

If God had never said anything against adultery, and I went around stoning women to death for i all of a sudden I am one of the righteous, and you would be queuing up behind me stone in hand.

I mean that the interpretation is skewed to fit preconceived perceptions, rather than taken and analysed at face value.

For example, the fact that a super-powerful entity capable of creating life is, by definition, good, irrespective of how it behaves.

Let us say that a super-powerful entity behaves badly. So we go to a greater super,super-powerful entity to get our cause justified. But that one behaves poorly as well. So we have to take our appeal up another level to a super, super, super-powerful entity to get our case fixed. But if we catch this super,spuer, super-powerful authority also making a bad call ? Then we have to find ourselves that one's superior and go to a super,super,super,super- powerful entity to get the unjust situation set right.

This scenario could go on in an endless regress. I ask you where do you think the last and final authority is ?

Do you think there is One for whom the cosmic buck actually stops ?
Are you that one ?

I believe that there is not an endless regress of umpires who can right call the bad call. I think the buck must have an end with God.

The faulty, incompetent and bungling God scenario, I think, is not realistic.

have to go now.

Originally posted by sonship
Occasionally, I think we need to get the point and not be destracted with hunting for microscopic loopholes of rationalization why we shouldn't listen to God's word.

Yes. I agree 100%.

But a lot of people hold themselves in such high esteem that they actually get insulted. Whether it's because they are not consulted on God's decisions or because God includes them without their permission is the subject of another thread.

This is also the hidden danger in these "we are all God" or "God is in all of us" philosophies.