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Originally posted by galveston75i think on this subject you are starting to feel how us 'atheists' feel when discussing the seemingly cruel nature of god with you guys. the answers you are getting from the likes of rj and bonoon, is the same logic you guys use to defend god.
Thanks. I may have missed it if RJH has offered some positive suggestions and has shown sympathy for all the killings that have been done by guns. I hope he has and I hoped I just didn't see them. But I haven't as of yet. If he has maybe he could show me those postings because as of now all I recall is him defending guns?
I kind of saw that same atti ...[text shortened]... if the GUNS were not in the picture I think it would be so much easier to stop most killings.
i know this is looks like im trying to be a smart arse, but im not, and despite what you may feel about the above, i have respect for your attitude about guns, especially as you seem to be one of the few americans on here to 'get it'.
Originally posted by stellspalfieThanks for the kind comments. And I do really understand what you are saying about your view of a God that seemingly has killed in the past. If I did not come to really undrstand what is behind his judgements, I would probaly feel the same as you.
i think on this subject you are starting to feel how us 'atheists' feel when discussing the seemingly cruel nature of god with you guys. the answers you are getting from the likes of rj and bonoon, is the same logic you guys use to defend god.
i know this is looks like im trying to be a smart arse, but im not, and despite what you may feel about the ...[text shortened]... itude about guns, especially as you seem to be one of the few americans on here to 'get it'.
But we are probably coming from this issue from two different viewpoints or maybe even the way we were raised.
For me I was about 6 when my family became JW's so I had not even started to know about God and the Bible and had no opinions one way or the other.
So I was taught about God and about the most pressing issue that faces us all and that is the condition of this world and what he is planning on doing to bring it back to a paradise that it once was and for all humans to live happily and safe, as in no guns.
So my first impressions and things taught to me from the Bible were all good and with hopeful viewpoints of the future.
And once I began to see how God from the very first sin of Adam, began putting the steps in motion that would finally get us back to the perfect earth he meant for us to be living on.
And once I started to understand why God has done the many things he's done, I knew they were all for a very specific reason and not just some spirit being out to get us all and make himself look bad.
So I understand that many have that terrible impression of God and wonder if he really does exist, why has he done the things we don't understand as humans or even condemn those things.
Originally posted by galveston75This world is not going to get back to a paradise, because man has already ruined that. It will take the destruction of the old and a recreation of a new world for us to ever realize paradise. This sin and death issue must by dealt with first. The government is not going to fix it by banning guns. You are not going to fix it by refusing to give blood to save lives. God and Christ is the answer. We can only occupy and do the work that we have been entrusted to do until the end is here. That work is to teach the good news of Christ to all the nations of the world. We can all do that in our own special ways, even if we only serve as bad examples.
Thanks for the kind comments. And I do really understand what you are saying about your view of a God that seemingly has killed in the past. If I did not come to really undrstand what is behind his judgements, I would probaly feel the same as you.
But we are probably coming from this issue from two different viewpoints or maybe even the way we were rai ...[text shortened]... exist, why has he done the things we don't understand as humans or even condemn those things.
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
Originally posted by RJHindsGod promised a paradise, no man can thwart his original purpose.
This world is not going to get back to a paradise, because man has already ruined that. It will take the destruction of the old and a recreation of a new world for us to ever realize paradise. This sin and death issue must by dealt with first. The government is not going to fix it by banning guns. You are not going to fix it by refusing to give blood to ...[text shortened]... ays, even if we only serve as bad examples.
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
Originally posted by RJHindsBad examples? Really?
This world is not going to get back to a paradise, because man has already ruined that. It will take the destruction of the old and a recreation of a new world for us to ever realize paradise. This sin and death issue must by dealt with first. The government is not going to fix it by banning guns. You are not going to fix it by refusing to give blood to ...[text shortened]... ays, even if we only serve as bad examples.
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
Originally posted by ZahlanziEvery 13 Seconds, an American Uses a Gun in Self Defense
so you honestly think that bubba the redneck can defend himself from the us army with a hunting rifle?
or that a french man or woman, should his/her government turn on the tyranny, cannot bash a soldier over the head and steal his gun, should he really want to fight his oppressors?
governments instituting oppressive regimes is a lengthy and compl ...[text shortened]... ression anywhere. american gun nuts are like people in the saharan desert stockpiling raincoats.
http://www.learnaboutguns.com/2008/08/01/every-13-seconds-an-american-uses-a-gun-in-self-defense/
When a gun is used to commit a crime, the focus is placed on the gun, but no focus is placed on the other tools criminals use to commit crimes. When a criminal uses a handgun to shoot a their victim, politicians and many members of the media will call for stricter gun control. This can be seen frequently in Chicago, a city which bans handguns but has hundreds of murders each year committed by criminals using handguns. Instead of recognizing that a person bent on committing murder and/or suicide won’t be deterred by a misdemeanor handgun possession charge, and that crime is caused by socioeconomic factors rather than the existence guns, they call for more gun control.
When criminals use tools other than guns, there is almost always no emphasis placed on the tool. Lighter fluid and gasoline are not blamed for arson. Cars are not blamed for a hit and run. Hammers and lead pipes are not blamed when someone is beaten to death. Knives are not blamed for stabbings. Bath tubs are not blamed when parents drown their children. Telephones and computers are not blamed when people commit fraud. Indeed, I could spend hours listing the many tools which criminals use to commit their crimes, but of all these tools only guns seem to receive blame.
This blaming of the gun rather than addressing the societal problems which lead to crime is worse than pointless. Many uninformed people will hear politicians and the media speak about “gun crime”, and will believe that taking away guns from law abiding citizens will somehow solve the problem. The fact is that it won’t, and the high murder rates in Chicago and Washington D.C. show that banning handguns will not keep them out of the hands of criminals, who can smuggle them in with drugs or steal one of the hundreds of millions of guns already in the country. The low crime rates in many rural areas which have virtually no gun laws also show that gun control does not mean less crime. The true cause of crime is not the presence of guns, but rather socioeconomic conditions. By declaring a war on guns, rather than a war on poverty, illiteracy, and unemployment, these politicians and media representatives are taking away the ability of law abiding citizens to defend themselves, and wasting resources that could be spent solving the real causes of crime. Please act to protect our gun rights, and insist that your elected officials focus on the real cause of crime rather than a convenient scapegoat.
http://www.learnaboutguns.com/2008/03/31/gun-crime-in-the-media/
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Originally posted by checkbaiterdid you actually read the peer reviewed paper where the page you linked took the data? it concludes that the study -
Every 13 Seconds, an American Uses a Gun in Self Defense
http://www.learnaboutguns.com/2008/08/01/every-13-seconds-an-american-uses-a-gun-in-self-defense/
'does not involve any measured benefit, it can shed no light on the benefits and costs of keeping guns in the home for protection.'
oops.
Many here have stated that things are getting better. Cosidering the world now with it's many growing issues, there seems to be no answers and no hope as they are truly getting worse.
But there are answers and there is hope. The ONLY hope we have:
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/g200606/peace-on-earth-at-last/
Originally posted by galveston75Jesus told His disciples to sell their coats and buy a weapon, if they did not have one. I think it is meant for us to have a weapon to defend ourselves today too.
Many here have stated that things are getting better. Cosidering the world now with it's many growing issues, there seems to be no answers and no hope as they are truly getting worse.
But there are answers and there is hope. The ONLY hope we have:
http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/g200606/peace-on-earth-at-last/