I can’t think of a worse thing

@fmf said
Thanks for the clarification. But it's also a dodge, right. The post you were ostensibly replying to was this:

Are you claiming that completely evil people, like you have claimed you are, are rewarded with immortality - even if they continue to be evil - for their religious beliefs - you are claiming this is "justice"?

It is the foundation of Christian belief, and you have to ask? We must be born again,
that is not human effort; it is a work of God in us, not us thinking happy thoughts all
about God, doing things in God's name, not doing things to be good enough, it is
relation with God doing in us a sanctifying work, making us more like Christ by
Christ being in us. Jesus said He was the Way, Truth, and the Life; it is simple without
Him, we are not saved, we need Jesus not something like Jesus, but Jesus.

@kellyjay said
It is the foundation of Christian belief, and you have to ask?

I am asking because you seem incapable of making it sound coherent. I am asking you about your belief and asking you to take responsibility for whatever you espouse. Referring to it as "the foundation of Christian belief" and asking if I "have to ask" ...on a discussion forum... is just you being evasive.

@kellyjay said
We must be born again,
that is not human effort; it is a work of God in us, not us thinking happy thoughts all
about God, doing things in God's name, not doing things to be good enough, it is
relation with God doing in us a sanctifying work, making us more like Christ by
Christ being in us. Jesus said He was the Way, Truth, and the Life; it is simple without
Him, we are not saved, we need Jesus not something like Jesus, but Jesus.

These sentences you have typed are very generic and clearly not aimed at addressing my specific point.

Are you claiming that this is "justice": ...

Completely evil people, as you have described yourself, are rewarded with immortality despite continuing to be evil and do evil - due to their religious beliefs pertaining to them declaring themselves "forgiven".

That's "justice" is it?

@kellyjay said
If evil is rewarded, its victims are left without justice, which is, in my opinion, far
worse in an eternal Kingdom where love is the supreme ethic.

[1] You have called my lack of Christian belief "evil"; who are my "victims"?

[2] If you believe some evil act you committed against someone is "forgiven" by your God figure, how is that "justice" for your victim?

@fmf said
I am asking because you seem incapable of making it sound coherent. I am asking you about your belief and asking you to take responsibility for whatever you espouse. Referring to it as "the foundation of Christian belief" and asking if I "have to ask" ...on a discussion forum... is just you being evasive.

I'm saying the reason I am justified is in Jesus Christ, not me; for my part, it is serving
and obeying the Lord, but He is the Redeemer. My part is laying down my life, picking
up the cross, and following Him. This is Biblical doctrine; it is not anything new; if it is
incoherent to you, how do you claim to understand my beliefs?

@fmf said
[1] You have called my lack of Christian belief "evil"; who are my "victims"?

[2] If you believe some evil act you committed against someone is "forgiven" by your God figure, how is that "justice" for your victim?

Why don't you try to give specifics when you claim I have said something? Quote me.
I often say one thing, and you and dive come back and accuse me of saying
something you think I mean when that is not true. If you ask me to justify something I
said, quote it so I know the context.

@kellyjay said
I'm saying the reason I am justified is in Jesus Christ, not me; for my part, it is serving
and obeying the Lord, but He is the Redeemer. My part is laying down my life, picking
up the cross, and following Him.

You seem to be peddling your bicycle as quickly as possible away from your odd notion of "justice".

@kellyjay said
Why don't you try to give specifics when you claim I have said something?

You have described yourself as "wicked" and "evil" countless times over the years. You even admitted very recently that you had done so when PB1022 called you out for it. Now, it may have been some disingenuous rhetorical false modesty on your part, but if you want to state unequivocally now that you are not evil and you are not wicked, then go ahead.

@kellyjay said
I often say one thing, and you and dive come back and accuse me of saying
something you think I mean when that is not true.

If you do not believe that all human beings are so evil that they deserve to be tortured for eternity after they die, including you, then say so, now. Yes, I know you believe you are "forgiven". But a pivotal point for your views on evil has always been that we are all evil, you, me, everybody.

@kellyjay said
This is Biblical doctrine; it is not anything new; if it is
incoherent to you, how do you claim to understand my beliefs?

It doesn't matter if it's a doctrine you got from a leaflet you read in a dentist's waiting room, if you cannot render it morally coherent in the context of discourse, then the fact you believe it, in and of itself, is evidence of nothing much, aside from the nature of your own mindmap.

@fmf said
You seem to be peddling your bicycle as quickly as possible away from your odd notion of "justice".

Justice is every wrong accounted for without exception; not sure why you think that
is odd.

@kellyjay said
If evil is rewarded, its victims are left without justice

You have called my lack of Christian belief "evil"; who are my "victims"? How am I "rewarded"?

@fmf said
You have described yourself as "wicked" and "evil" countless times over the years. You even admitted very recently that you had done so when PB1022 called you out for it. Now, it may have been some disingenuous rhetorical false modesty on your part, but if you want to state unequivocally now that you are not evil and you are not wicked, then go ahead.

Correct, we are all sinners and have fallen short; we all need a redeemer; we cannot
do it ourselves. It is a condition we all share, including me. There is nothing
disingenuous about that, no false modesty claiming I need Christ to save me
because I cannot do it myself and declaring no one else can either. Nothing about
that makes me better than anyone else; only Christ can do that. If you think you are
fine just the way you are, there is pride there.

@kellyjay said
Justice is every wrong accounted for without exception; not sure why you think that
is odd.

Justice is where "wrong" is "accounted for".

Where do you get the "without exception" part from?

@kellyjay said
Justice is every wrong accounted for without exception; not sure why you think that
is odd.

If you believe some evil act you committed against someone is "forgiven" by your God figure, how is that "justice" for your victim?