Predestination and Noah's ark

Originally posted by RJHinds
Don't follow an immoral leader.

Should they have executed all Germans after 1945?

Originally posted by FMF
What is the Christian moral lesson that humans who are "not guilty of their leaders' sins" can learn from this?

It is a matter of authority, it matters! When you have a good leader or bad,
good and bad happen to those that follow. If all we see is bad, well, what
does that tell you? To whom much is given much is excepted, it is a the
reality of life we all see in my opinion. You read the scriptures, do you recall
how Israel was treated with good kings and how they were with bad?

Nations are judged by the leadership, each one of us will be judged for our
own actions. I would remind you too since you seem to be caught up in
the "not guilty" none of us are "not guilty" we have all fallen short.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
I would remind you too since you seem to be caught up in
the "not guilty" none of us are "not guilty" we have all fallen short.

Have we all "fallen short" to the degree that we all deserve to be executed?

Originally posted by KellyJay
It is a matter of authority, it matters! When you have a good leader or bad, good and bad happen to those that follow.

"A matter of authority... good or bad"? Why do you think it is that your God figure follows the same code as dictators and gangsters?

Originally posted by FMF
Have we all "fallen short" to the degree that we all deserve to be executed?

I was under the impression that you read scripture, you are not familiar
with falling short with God?
Kelly

Originally posted by FMF
"A matter of authority... good or bad"? Why do you think it is that your God figure follows the same code as dictators and gangsters?

I'm not sure what you are asking.
You have read the Old Testament correct, the books of 1st and 2nd Kings?
Kelly

Originally posted by RJHinds
Sometime genocide is the best medicine.

you should have that embroidered

Originally posted by divegeester
If you don't accept predestination, how do you account for the 2 scriptures in the OP?

the author trying to feel good about himself, by making himself "speshul". the chosen ones.


if he predestines, then there can be no accountability for ones actions. you can't have god directing your actions and god getting pissed because of your actions at the same time.


in truth, jesus states that the kingdom of heaven can be had by anyone. not by pre-approved applicants.


this just another instance of paul being a smartass

Originally posted by RJHinds
Don't follow an immoral leader.

the child who had no idea how to tie his sandals born in those times should have known better. his wicked five year old behind got what was coming to him, which is a slow death by drowning.

for his numerous sins.

Originally posted by KellyJay
I was under the impression that you read scripture, you are not familiar
with falling short with God?
Kelly

I am not asking you about your impression about me. Let's forget the expression "fallen short" for now if it's a stumbling block ~ and let me ask about the same thing in a different way. How did the children killed in the flood deserve to be killed?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I'm not sure what you are asking.
You have read the Old Testament correct, the books of 1st and 2nd Kings?
Kelly

I am asking you about this rationale behind gangsterism ~ which is what you appeared to be alluding to ~ i.e. "It is a matter of authority, it matters!" ~ when I asked you what is the Christian moral lesson to be drawn from your God figure's treatment of any innocents killed in the genocide he brought upon them.

Originally posted by FMF
I am not asking you about your impression about me. Let's forget the expression "fallen short" for now if it's a stumbling block ~ and let me ask about the same thing in a different way. How did the children killed in the flood deserve to be killed?

The world was full of sin, as I pointed out to you with respect to leadership
those in charge have the care of those under them. This goes to parents
too, if a parent leads his or her family down a path of destruction the family
goes down the path of destruction. This world does not make keep the
children from experiencing the heartache that their parents take them
through.

No child deserves to be born with a craving for drugs, or anything else that
a parent causes them to desire by their actions and not the child's. The
whole of the human race was judged, that meant all of them. God spared a
few and it did not take long before they started screwing up either.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
God and genocide, I think is a worthless conversation since everyone's
death and I do mean everyone's death comes down to God. If God does it
one at a time, or in mass it is still God who sets up universe and
all the laws within it.
Kelly

One thing you haven't discussed is the fact (according to this tale) that ALL the land animals were included in this genocide. I don't know what to call this but extinction. All but a few of all the land animals AND humans.

Why would your god make a beautiful live filled planet and then destroy the genetic diversity of it all with such a cruel action.

Exactly what did all those animals do to deserve dying by the billions or more?

All that total BS just to get rid of a few thousand humans this god was ticked off at?

It just shows how ridiculous a story it is.

It might fly as a apocryphal tale ( worship the lord or suffer the consequences or it COULD happen just like this,etc.)

As reality it fails on many levels.

Besides, modern genetic analysis has shown what species is suffering from loss of genetic diversity and there are a few like Leopards which apparently almost went extinct and the gene pool shows.

Most other animals shows a rich diversity in their genes which shows there was no mass extinction like the bible says.

So there was no flood, Noah never built an Ark unless he was taking too many magic mushrooms.

Originally posted by KellyJay
The world was full of sin, as I pointed out to you with respect to leadership
those in charge have the care of those under them. This goes to parents
too, if a parent leads his or her family down a path of destruction the family
goes down the path of destruction. This world does not make keep the
children from experiencing the heartache that their paren ...[text shortened]... them. God spared a
few and it did not take long before they started screwing up either.
Kelly

This is your rationale for God killing innocent children?

Originally posted by FMF
This is your rationale for God killing innocent children?

I pointed out to you that all of us are sinners, every single one! I also told
you that God has this universe setup so that we will all die, every single one.
There is no exception, there is no "I'm not fair game because I'm to young"
age either. A very harsh truth is, is none of us, NOT a one is promised
tomorrow. There isn't an innocent age of protection for children!

We do not respect children's lives, we kill them in the mother's womb just
because we ordain it is the right of the mother to do so if she does not
wish to have a child. People sell children into sex slaves, they turn them
into soldiers making them fight in wars, they turn them into drug users and
pushers. They kill them after they are born alive, because the abortion did
not go well!

The difference between God and man is that God takes care of them after
they die here, we do not. We just slaughter them here for our personal
desires are full filled, so we get out of them what we want and they can
be pitched into ovens so their burning bodies can keep us warm.
Kelly