@josephw saidYou will be feeling rough tomorrow morning, make sure you are up bright and breezy for driving those old ladies to church.
Channel yer orifice.
@filthyherman saidThanks...
I done believe in predestination as you always have a choice. So when people say “there is nothing we can do” it probably means there is nothing that springs to kind, or maybe they feel too helpless emotionally, but you can always do something.
Then we get into the question of if God (should you believe in him) can look into your future and see what you are likely to ...[text shortened]... t the same as predestination. Could God look at you and your probability of being saved? I think so.
@medullah saidU R welcome....
I like this post. One question though.
Are the predestined predestined at the outset (birth) or do they become predestined after they have first met a certain set of criteria? I don’t know or have a hidden answer as I have only just noticed this (so thanks for posting).
@divegeester saidYour specialty.
Ignore him he’s probably drunk.
But I can help you with your unbelief!
@divegeester saidIf you're misunderstood, that's your fault.
Actually yes, but I think you have misunderstood me.
Nevermind.
@divegeester saidDang!
I don’t have to explain it.
The bible contains powerful compelling evidence that both predestination AND free choice exist in parallel.
You actually get that.
Calvinism/Arminianism
Sovereignty of God and the responsibility of man.
Both exist in the Bible throughout.
@josephw saidYes, very much so.
Dang!
You actually get that.
Calvinism/Arminianism
Sovereignty of God and the responsibility of man.
Both exist in the Bible throughout.
I’ve laid out the NT scriptures for predestination on page one of this thread, why don’t you go read them instead of ignoring them like all the other deniers are such as KellyJay and Galveston75.
Get back to me then.
@divegeester
Ok buddy here ya go. Now before I decided to use up my time on you I'm hoping you can respect this and keep some of your usual comments to yourself. If you cannot be respectful then this is it. My time is valuable and if you can't respect the process of this forum that's your problem. So here is a chance, don't blow it.
First if predestination ruled it all then why pray? Why the Bible? Why did Jehovah create us with free will? Why did Jesus give his life for us? Etc, etc. Think about those things.
So what about those scriptures you quoted? Yes without digging a little deeper with understanding it appears they do support the type of predestination you are thinking of. They aren't.
Solomon’s did say: “For everything there is an appointed time, even a time for every affair under the heavens: a time for birth and a time to die.” (Ecclesiastes 3:1, 2) But was Solomon really saying this in the way you are taking it?
No.....
He was not saying that births and deaths are predestined. His point is that births and deaths, like other things in life, come in endless cycles. He also said life will have ups and downs: “There is . . . a time to weep and a time to laugh. ((((((Unforeseen))))))) calamities, are life, to “every affair under the heavens.” (Ecclesiastes 3:1-8; 9:11, 12)
Moses wrote this about Jehovah:“I do take the heavens and the earth as witnesses against you today, that I have put life and death before you, the blessing and the malediction; and you must choose life in order that you may keep alive, you and your offspring.” (Deuteronomy 30:19)
Jehovah was giving them an option about life. They could choose. No predestination there.
Adam could have chosen when Eve came to him with the fruit. He choose her instead of obeying Jehovah. No predestination there.
The Bible is more then full of humans choosing good or bad, life or death.....
This thought of predestination you are thinking of has no backing anywhere in the bible.
The scriptures you use to say it is are simply saying that all things in life will happen. Yes I can predict that you will die because of old age either by sickness or what ever.
Is that predestination as you understand it? Will I'm predicting you will die!!!! God is predicting we all will die if we practice sin, right?
Just do a little research online about predestination....
@galveston75 saidDont blow it Dive, otherwise the man is going to go home.
@divegeester
Ok buddy here ya go. Now before I decided to use up my time on you I'm hoping you can respect this and keep some of your usual comments to yourself. If you cannot be respectful then this is it. My time is valuable and if you can't respect the process of this forum that's your problem. So here is a chance, don't blow it.
First if predestination ruled i ...[text shortened]... ll will die if we practice sin, right?
Just do a little research online about predestination....
@divegeester saidJohn 6:44
But how can we make that choice to choose God when the bible tells us no one seeks god (Romans 3:10)?
No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
Hebrews 7:25
Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them.
Having God draws us toward Him leads us to seek Him; everything we do, we do with each other. It is not much different from love; you can love another, but it will never develop into a loving relationship unless they love you to do it.
Hebrews 11:6
And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.
Psalm 27:8
You have said, “Seek my face.” My heart says to you, “Your face, Lord, do I seek.”
Psalm 119:1-3
Blessed are those whose way is blameless, who walk in the law of the Lord! Blessed are those who keep his testimonies, who seek him with their whole heart, who also do no wrong, but walk in his ways!
Jeremiah 29:13
You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.