@fmf saidIrrelevant.
Rajk999 does not assert that people who do not share his beliefs are unable to tell the difference between maggots and humans.
Rajk just calls anyone that doesn't agree with him maggots, and a variety of other names, but you say nothing to him about it.
@secondson saidIt seems you still haven't read what sonship posted.
Wrong. You're just doing what you always do. You just can't seem to quit projecting your bias into what sonship is saying, so that what comes out of you is a mischaracterization of sonship's intent.
@caissad4 saidWhen Jesus returns it will be you that will realize who was willfully ignorant.
The Marcionites were indeed Christians . The believed in one god being "superior" to a lesser god . Stop thumping your bible for a few minutes and read the history of YOUR religion . You are willfully ignorant , aren't you ?
Won't you be shocked!
@ghost-of-a-duke saidThere is the god of this world, Satan, but he is a created being whose time if very short. The nature of God is He is in total harmony where all of His attributes are in complete agreement at all times from His Righteousness, Holiness, Loving Kindness, Goodness and the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are also in perfect harmony they are One. We have a lot of people including you who look at God and only look at Him in terms of maybe one attribute excluding all others so that when you are exposed to the others, you don't accept them as the same God.
A slight digression, but the Japanese have 2 words for God, one that describes his peaceful loving side and the other to describe his violent side.
The Christian God is clearly not omnibenevolent. He just isn't.
Those who only look at God's love, for example, nearly reject He is Good and Righteous, and Just nature. Some do this to the point that they think God loves them just the way they are, which isn't Biblical. You should not walk up to a child molester put your hand on their shoulders and say, "God loves you just as you are." God is righteous and Holy, the thing that needs to be told someone like that is REPENT and turn towards God for the forgiveness of sins before you are confronted with a Holy God who will repay you for all the things you have done.
It is possible even to anger the Spirit of Grace.
Hebrews 10:29
How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has trampled underfoot the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?
@ghost-of-a-duke said@kellyjay said
This would be a more plausible position if the OT didn't exist.
Except Christians believe there is only One God.
@ghost-of-a-duke said
"This would be a more plausible position if the OT didn't exist."
What does that mean?
I could be wrong, but I think what Kelly meant was that there are no other gods.
There is one God. That fact is make perfectly clear throughout the Bible.
@secondson saidsonship believes that atheists cannot differentiate between human beings and maggots because they lack his religious beliefs. He is mistaken.
You won't be able to filter this through your position of disbelief, but it's not sonship's beliefs that matter.
sonship's beliefs "matter" only in so far as he has expressed them on this debate and discussion.
If you think sonship's beliefs don't matter - with regard to atheists and maggots - then it's not clear why you are addressing me repeatedly over the issue of what he said.
@secondson saidYes, there is only one, and Christians believe that. There is no other God besides God, He always was, is, and is to come. No god has formed besides Him, He created all by the power of His Word.
@kellyjay said
Except Christians believe there is only One God.
@ghost-of-a-duke said
"This would be a more plausible position if the OT didn't exist."
What does that mean?
I could be wrong, but I think what Kelly meant was that there are no other gods.
There is one God. That fact is make perfectly clear throughout the Bible.
@sonship saidGnostics did not refer to themselves as gnostics in ancient times . There was no branch of Christianity which was named "gnostic" per se . History added the name many centuries later . They were/are Christians . I knew a gnostic 15 years ago and can say unequivocally that they believe in Jesus' resurrection from the dead . They are Christians .
There is one God Who went through a process to accomplish His plan.
Caissadr's showy selective appeal to the old heretical polytheism of the Gnostics changes this not, even if some Christians were caught up in the bad teaching.
The "Word was with God, and the Word was God" - the same God as throughout the entire Bible.
And "the Word became flesh and tabe ...[text shortened]... to us.
One three-one - triune God passing through two [b]"becames" to carry out His economy.
@kellyjay saidSo you believe in a "lesser god" named Satan . How cute .
There is the god of this world, Satan, but he is a created being whose time if very short. The nature of God is He is in total harmony where all of His attributes are in complete agreement at all times from His Righteousness, Holiness, Loving Kindness, Goodness and the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are also in perfect harmony they are One. We have a lot of people including yo ...[text shortened]... profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?
@caissad4
I said some Christians were caught up in any number of beliefs, sometimes unwittingly. Same as today.
I don't know what you think it accomplishes to say there was the Marcionite teaching that some Christians taught.
That gives you comfort somehow that there is no truth to the gospels?
1 edit
I knew a gnostic 15 years ago and can say unequivocally that they believe in Jesus' resurrection from the dead . They are Christians .
So what?
When the large net of "Whosoever believes" collects people they sometimes bring with them their divergent concepts.
A reading of the book of Acts tells us the early church contained some differing opinions on things.
A reading of First Corinthians shows us that.
Christ is an available and living Person, unusual, but available and living. That Christians bring along with them divergent opinions about other things doesn't make Christ not a living available Lord.
Actually I think your hand waving about the Marcionites is self defeating about some of your previous objections about the history of the Gospels. This very early deviancy goes as evidence there was something for them to maintain alternative views about, namely the four gospels.
Eventually we'll see that collecting all your objections together, they kind of cancel each other out.
@sonship saidIt is all history . Does not your holy, holy book say that the truth will set you free ?
I said some Christians were caught up in any number of beliefs, sometimes unwittingly. Same as today.
I don't know what you think it accomplishes to say there was the Marcionite teaching that some Christians taught.
That gives you comfort somehow that there is no truth to the gospels?
Christian beliefs were not codified until c.e. 397 in Carthage , I believe . The Council of Nicaea did not codify Christian beliefs . There were numerous Christian sects pre-codification believing a wide range of different things . Then it was decided to declare all those who did not believe in the codified beliefs as heretics . The things the Christians of today "believe" were decided by a vote of the bishops , hardly divine .
It does not give me comfort that there is no truth in the gospels.
Does it give you comfort somehow that there is no truth to the gospels ? (your words turned back to you)