25 Aug 15
2 edits
Originally posted by checkbaiterI've repeated myself to you more than once. It isn't God taking someone's life and
Why would God have to "harden the hearts" of those who reject him?
They are already lost. It doesn't make sense. They harden their own heart.
Look, my point in all of this is Satan hardened Pharaoh's heart not God. It is the figure of speech "Metonomy".
There is good reason for God to use this figure. Believers in the Old Testament did not have "Chris ...[text shortened]... them from the grasp of Satan.
God is good, God is love, and He wants us to be good Ambassadors.
physically hardening their hearts. It is God showing them Himself, His kindness, His
mercy, His love and their hearts get hard. He does the same thing to those that turn
towards Him, we choose which way we are going. God sent Jesus to die for all of us,
every single one, He does not want any of us to perish, but that we all come to
repentance and turn towards Him, He does not sin nor does He tempt anyone to sin, and
He most certainly doesn't FORCE sin into us.
We love our sins, we love our wicked ways, when we are confronted with God that will
without a doubt produce a reaction from us! We either due to His mercy and loving
kindness turn from our wicked ways, or we dig in to hide, when we do we harden our very
hearts toward God.
God knew Pharaoh, and when God revealed Himself to him he dug in, his heart was then
harden against God. So God harden His heart, YES, he was either going to repent like
those that Jonah preached to, or continue in the rebellion of sin and wickedness. He was
either going to turn to God like those that saw Jesus raise someone from the dead, or
he was going to plot to kill both Jesus and Lazarus there are choices that will be made.
Faith is a gift from God to those that turn towards Him, the GIFT of the Holy Spirit in us
reveals God to us. It is all Jesus Christ, He saves us, He is our sure foundation in that
we agree. So yes, God is good, outside of God we are not.
25 Aug 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterPeople read the Bible and twist it to their own destruction, that has been going on for along
Ok, I see what you mean. But people read this differently than what you propose.
time now. At least you grasp my meaning now, you do not have to agree with it, but you
understand.
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25 Aug 15
Originally posted by KellyJayYes, I understand but I believe it is a figure of speech.
People read the Bible and twist it to their own destruction, that has been going on for along
time now. At least you grasp my meaning now, you do not have to agree with it, but you
understand.
25 Aug 15
Originally posted by KellyJaysome twist it so that it isn't horrible anymore.
People read the Bible and twist it to their own destruction, that has been going on for along
time now. At least you grasp my meaning now, you do not have to agree with it, but you
understand.
25 Aug 15
Originally posted by ZahlanziI think that is as bad...there are parts of the Bible that are very horrible, it cannot get any
some twist it so that it isn't horrible anymore.
worse....watering that down to make it all sugar and spice does not reflect the reality that
is in scriptures some times.
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26 Aug 15
1 edit
Originally posted by KellyJayThen you have a bible full of contradictions. That's ok though right?
I think that is as bad...there are parts of the Bible that are very horrible, it cannot get any
worse....watering that down to make it all sugar and spice does not reflect the reality that
is in scriptures some times.
Any serious bible student should have at least a basic understanding of Figures of Speech in the bible....
Here is a quick link to ponder..
http://rhetoric.byu.edu/Figures/Groupings/by%20Author/Bullinger.htm
26 Aug 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterNo, I don't have a Bible full of contradictions.
Then you have a bible full of contradictions. That's ok though right?
Any serious bible student should have at least a basic understanding of Figures of Speech in the bible....
Here is a quick link to ponder..
http://rhetoric.byu.edu/Figures/Groupings/by%20Author/Bullinger.htm
I don't agree with your views on that topic, I do not consider that a figure of speech and
I gave you my reasons for my views. You can use figures of speech to alter what you do
not like, completely up to you.
Originally posted by ZahlanziYou continue to miss the entire point of the Bible.
those that believe in the global flood justify it by saying "well everybody was evil, the world had to end".
so what does that mean?
let's consider that being evil means you are being evil towards someone else. i don't care much if what you do is not affecting anyone. i don't care if you have evil thoughts if you don't act on them.
so one being ...[text shortened]... l his hammer.
the conclusion is that god destroyed a LOT of victims in the global flood.
"And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD." -- Genesis 6:1-8, KJV
What does that mean, you ask? It is pretty straightforward, but just in case you need a further hint:
"The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence.
And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.
And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth." -- Genesis 6:11-13, KJV
This is pretty clear what was meant.
This is the mistake you continually make. You seem to think that somehow, man deserves something from God. Man deserves nothing from God. Man is God's creation, God is not man's creation. God is without sin, man is loaded down with sin. But God loves man, so much that he gave his only begotten Son to save man from the fate he really deserves, the Lake of Fire. But somehow you miss this most fundamental lesson in all the Bible.
26 Aug 15
Originally posted by KellyJaybut i disagree. i think casting out some parts of the bible is actually dictated by the new testament.
I think that is as bad...there are parts of the Bible that are very horrible, it cannot get any
worse....watering that down to make it all sugar and spice does not reflect the reality that
is in scriptures some times.
jesus never specifically says "ot bad, throw it away". how many times does he contradict the OT, though? "turn the other cheek" as opposed to "eye for an eye". "love your enemy" as opposed to "love your brother, kill your enemy". he helped "idol worshipers" as opposed to having them killed and he didn't even ask they convert first.
his whole life was about helping others, teaching us to help and love each other. what part of jesus's life makes you think he would condone putting a city to the sword? he sent his 12 apostles to spread his words, he didn't build an army to conquer and force people to follow him.
an eternal being doesn't completely change his personality in 2000 years. therefore the god of the OT was never real. the real god is the god who sent his son to make sure we get the message right this time.
26 Aug 15
Originally posted by Suzianne"And some twist it so that even God is somehow a sinner."
And some twist it so that even God is somehow a sinner.
Did I mention that you miss the entire point of the Bible?
god is not a sinner.
the fabrication in the OT, if it where real, would be a horrible god, true. he isn't though. he never was real.
26 Aug 15
Originally posted by Suziannehe point of the bible is to teach us love and compassion. to set jesus as an example to follow.
You continue to miss the entire point of the Bible.
"And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he ...[text shortened]... deserves, the Lake of Fire. But somehow you miss this most fundamental lesson in all the Bible.
not to present massacres as good ideas.
26 Aug 15
Originally posted by ZahlanziHave you read the NT, it is much bloodier than the Old.
but i disagree. i think casting out some parts of the bible is actually dictated by the new testament.
jesus never specifically says "ot bad, throw it away". how many times does he contradict the OT, though? "turn the other cheek" as opposed to "eye for an eye". "love your enemy" as opposed to "love your brother, kill your enemy". he helped "idol worshi ...[text shortened]... real. the real god is the god who sent his son to make sure we get the message right this time.