@suzianne saidUnfortunately, I haven’t seen the movie, but based on what I read on here, isn’t it possible (and simpler) for God to just direct a deer to the door?
I do think the deer was an angel. I don't think it was Jesus, as its assigned task was a simple one, to distract the man from what he was contemplating. You don't send the Boss to do a minion's task.
I speak from experience in this regard.
Again, may be speaking out of turn and from ignorance ‘cause I haven’t seen the movie.
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@pb1022 saidQuite.
And what do y’all make of this:
“I am the Lord: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.”
(Isaiah 42:8)
“And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.”
(John 17:5)
If God won’t give His glory to another, as He says in Isaiah, and Jesus Christ ...[text shortened]... od, then how did Jesus have God the Father’s glory before the world was, as Jesus says in John 17:5?
Just for a quick grin, compare John 17:5 with the same verse in the NWT.
Edit: it appears to be nearly the same. To tell the truth, I expected them to leave it out, or change it to something insensible. I wonder how they explain that.
@suzianne saidYep, that’s some tortured language but it’s still not compatible with that verse in Isaiah.
Quite.
Just for a quick grin, compare John 17:5 with the same verse in the NWT.
Edit: it appears to be nearly the same. To tell the truth, I expected them to leave it out, or change it to something insensible. I wonder how they explain that.
Maybe a JW will explain how those two verses in Isaiah and John get reconciled.
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@pb1022 saidThis is possible, maybe even probable, since the deer just did what deer do (I mean nothing special like speaking to the man).
Unfortunately, I haven’t seen the movie, but based on what I read on here, isn’t it possible (and simpler) for God to just direct a deer to the door?
Again, may be speaking out of turn and from ignorance ‘cause I haven’t seen the movie.
But I don't think the deer was Jesus (or God, which was the original question). It did have almost deific timing, but still.
This isn’t what Jesus Christ said about Himself, but a Messianic prophecy of who Jesus would be:
“For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.”
(Isaiah 9:6)
So the names that the child and son will be called include “The mighty God” and “The everlasting Father.”
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@pb1022 saidPersonally I rather be cautious about interpreting the bible so loosely without reading carefully what is being said.
Even the NWT has the son’s name in Isaiah 9:6 as “Mighty God” and “Eternal Father.”
Isaiah is saying what names people will give to Christ.
That is totally different from what the Father called His Son.
There are several examples of this I have seen among Christians. Others:
- Thomas called Jesus his Lord and God
[Again personally I dont care to take my doctrinal truth from Thomas]
- The Pharisees thought Jesus was calling himself God
[ Definitely not ... I dont care to take my doctrine from the conclusions of Pharisees]
- The Catholic Church devised the doctrine of the Trinity and others Triune
[ No Thank YOU !]
I take my doctrine from the mouth of Jesus Christ. The confusion and argument and false doctrines arise when people do otherwise.
The clearest statement of who Jesus was, and sanctioned by God and confirmed by Christ is this
When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets. He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
(Matthew 16:13-17 KJV)
Simple - Men can say what they want. God revealed that Jesus is His Son.
End of Story. Who wants to argue and add and embellish and change that then they are on their way to false teachings.
@chaney3 saidI think my meaning may have been misinterpreted with this post.
"The Shack"
A friend of mine wanted me to watch this movie, so I did. There was an important scene in which the man was going to shoot himself in the shack. But....a deer showed up at the door, which made the man reconsider his intentions. (I'm going by memory)
Anyway, when I was finished watching the movie, my friend asked me this question: "do you think that the deer ...[text shortened]... an observation. Not sure why exactly I fight with the Trinity. God can do whatever He chooses to do.
I am not trying to debate whether or not God was the deer, but rather that it was 'possible' that God was the deer.
I remember how quickly I said yes, it's possible. But, I don't really extend the same thought so readily when it comes to Jesus.
I'm not sure why.
@pb1022 saidNo not at all. Don't believe I said that.
Surely you’re not expecting the name “Jesus Christ” to appear in the Old Testament. The Son of God received the name “Jesus” upon His birth to the Virgin Mary.
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@PB1022
But they argue that there is a difference between the Mighty God and the Almighty God. But Jehovah is called BOTH.
I thought I'd give Living Stream Ministry a break this morning.
Copied without permission from Truth and Grace -
http://www.truth-and-grace.com/is-jehovah-the-mighty-god/
[My bolding]
Jehovah’s Witnesses Watchtower Society rejects Jesus Christ as God. The original Jehovah’s Witnesses Watchtower Society argument against the deity of Jesus Christ was that there was only one God, Jehovah, therefore Jesus could not be God. They had a problem with Isaiah 9:6 and John 1:1, in which He is clearly referred to as “mighty God” and “God”, so The Watchtower Society adapted their teaching; they now say that Jesus is the mighty God, but Jehovah is Almighty God. In other words, in order to support their argument that Jesus is not God because there is only one God, they assert at least two Gods: Jesus the mighty God and Jehovah the Almighty God.
HOWEVER - (and check your ASV where Lord is always Jehovah)
Gen 49:24 But his (Joseph) bow abode in strength, and the arms of his hands were made strong by the hands of the mighty God of Jacob; (from thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel 46 only
Deut 10:17 For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward 1368, 410
Ps 50:1 The mighty God, even the LORD, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof 410, 430
Ps 132:2 How he sware unto the LORD, and vowed unto the mighty God of Jacob 46
Ps 132:5 Until I find out a place for the LORD, an habitation for the mighty God of Jacob. 46
Is 1:24 Therefore saith the LORD, the LORD of hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Ah, I will ease me of mine adversaries, and avenge me of mine enemies 46
Is 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, the mighty God, the everlasting Father, the Prince of Peace. 1368, 410
Is 30:29 Ye shall have a song, as in the night when a holy solemnity is kept; and gladness of heart, as when one goeth with a pipe to come into the mountain of the LORD, to the mighty One of Israel. 6697
Is 49:26 And I will feed them that oppress thee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob. 46
Is 60:16 Thou shalt also suck the milk of the Gentiles, and shalt suck the breast of kings: and thou shalt know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob 46
Jer 32:18 Thou showed lovingkindness unto thousands, and recompense the iniquity of the fathers into the bosom of their children after them: the Great, the Mighty God, the LORD of hosts, is his name… 1368, 410
Hab 1:12 Art thou not from everlasting, O LORD my God, mine Holy One? We shall not die. O LORD, thou hast ordained them for judgment; and, O mighty God, thou hast established them for correction. 6697 *
In each of: Ps 50:1, Jer 32:18, and Habbakuk 1:12, “the mighty God” is identified as YHWH, the name of the only Living and True God. In Gen 49:24, Ps 132, the LORD is referred to as “the mighty God of Jacob”, and in Is 1:24, 30:29, 49:26, and 60:16, He is referred to as “the mighty one of Jacob” or “of Israel”. In other words, in every reference to “the mighty God” or “the mighty one”, the party to whom it refers is specifically stated to be YHWH, or “Jehovah”.
@sonship saidSo since your Bible uses the name Jehovah in it as it this clearly shows, why do you not use it?
@PB1022
But they argue that there is a difference between the Mighty God and the Almighty God. But Jehovah is called BOTH.
I thought I'd give Living Stream Ministry a break this morning.
Copied without permission from Truth and Grace -
http://www.truth-and-grace.com/is-jehovah-the-mighty-god/
[My bolding]
Jehovah’s Witnesses ...[text shortened]... e mighty one”, the party to whom it refers is specifically stated to be YHWH, or “Jehovah”.
When Jesus came to earth why did he not tell everyone that the name of Jehovah was now obsolete and that since he, Jesus was God and the same being, we should only use the name of Jesus when speaking about himself in the future?
That seems to be the way it has been now for a few hundred years because in most bibles the name Jehovah has been taken out with only a token couple times left in a few Bibles?
@galveston75 saidGod the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit are separate entities but all God and all equally God.
So since your Bible uses the name Jehovah in it as it this clearly shows, why do you not use it?
When Jesus came to earth why did he not tell everyone that the name of Jehovah was now obsolete and that since he, Jesus was God and the same being, we should only use the name of Jesus when speaking about himself in the future?
That seems to be the way it has been now f ...[text shortened]... most bibles the name Jehovah has been taken out with only a token couple times left in a few Bibles?
If Jesus by Himself were God, who raised Him from the dead? Who did He cry out to on the Cross?
@pb1022 saidThanks. But you know that the bible never once said that they are equal. Only Trinitairians say that.
God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit are separate entities but all God and all equally God.
If Jesus by Himself were God, who raised Him from the dead? Who did He cry out to on the Cross?
But anyway if you get the chance and would like to see where the trinity teaching came from, here it is. I've posted it before as well as a few other non JW links that again shows it origin.
https://www.trinitytruth.org/paganoriginsofthetrinity.html
@galveston75 saidI believe in the Trinity, I believe they are all equally God, but not all equal.
Thanks. But you know that the bible never once said that they are equal. Only Trinitairians say that.
But anyway if you get the chance and would like to see where the trinity teaching came from, here it is. I've posted it before as well as a few other non JW links that again shows it origin.
https://www.trinitytruth.org/paganoriginsofthetrinity.html