Originally posted by JamesqtI was just looking through the side that took the field for Liverpool and notice that Torres was not in the starting line up or on the bench, Keane came off after 66 mins. It would appear that unless it was due to injuries that they must have expected a walk over, or they thought Kuyt could do it single handed 🙂
Brilliant call...at 1-0 down I thought Arsenal had no chance!
What a fantastic weekend for Man U, the iceing on the cake was West Ham surprisingly holding the 'Pool to a draw!
Originally posted by MctaytoTorres has a hamstring injury and is out for 2 or 3 weeks.
I was just looking through the side that took the field for Liverpool and notice that Torres was not in the starting line up or on the bench, Keane came off after 66 mins. It would appear that unless it was due to injuries that they must have expected a walk over, or they thought Kuyt could do it single handed 🙂
Rafa has consistently being bringing off Keane at about 65 minutes each game, its not doing his confidence much good.
You've got it right, Kuyt has been saving Liverpool in many games this season, if not Kuyt then Gerrard.
I think Rafa played what he thought was his best side, but its frustrating a lot of LFC supporters because they want to see Babel starting and playing up front with Keane and for Keane to be given a run of 90 minute games.
Liverpools lucky season is starting to catch up with them.
Their squad is too thin, they can't break down teams that defend, so look boring to watch.
They are a team of big time charlies, they'll probably beat Arsenal in a few weeks time when they play them and look good doing it.
Then draw against a bottom 3 team the week after, with one shot on target and a Gerrard dive in the box turned down now the luck is running out.
You can't win the league this way, they just had a lot of luck with 88 minutes goals, penalties and players being sent off giving them a man advantage in games.
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Liverpools lucky season is starting to catch up with them.You're (ManU fans) all starting to sound very worried to me.
Their squad is too thin, they can't break down teams that defend, so look boring to watch.
They are a team of big time charlies, they'll probably beat Arsenal in a few weeks time when they play them and look good doing it.
Then draw against a bottom 3 team the week after, with one shot on target and a Gerrard dive in the box turned 88 minutes goals, penalties and players being sent off giving them a man advantage in games.
Originally posted by Angry BoyI was worried, but......
You're (ManU fans) all starting to sound very worried to me.
Chelsea seem to have lost the unbelieveable strength they had over the last 4 years.
Until this season you could see Chelsea winning 17 out of 20 games and to compete against that is extreamly difficult.
United had a bad start (by our standards) and after 12 games or so were averaging aboiut 1.7 points per game, not title winning stuff.
Liverpool had a great start (for varius reasons I won't go into) and if they were able to maintiain that level of "results" (not performance) then they had a chance of winning the league.
Today we have this situation:-
- United have had a bad season start by our standards
- Liverpool have had their best ever and are top of the league
- Chelsea are up there, ahead of United and are title favourates
BUT......................
Over the last 2 weeks:-
Chelsea have started to look soft
- This is the first time in the Ambromovich era
- Maybe its the loss of Essien and Makelele
- Maybe its the bad team spirit with Drogba sulking and Anelka leading the line (lol)
Liverpool after a great points scoring start:-
- Play poorly almost every game
- Never really look like scoring
- Torres is injured again 🙂
- Keane looks like another Rafa big money flop, maybe they should sell him in January and bring back Crouch, Owen or Heskey 🙄
And most importantly:-
- United have played 6 home games and 8 away games (against the teams that finished 2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9 last season) - has there ever been such a difficult start?
- After everyone writing off United we are now in a position that if we win ALL OUR GAMES we win the league NO MATTER what other teams do.
Not bad at all after a VERY difficult start to the season.
Maybe United will win the quadrouple this year?
(What you gotta say about that dicky?)
Nice way for Sir Alex to leave the game.
Originally posted by MctaytoWell Mctayto, lets ask posters how crap United are compared to Celtic and Arsenal....
Utd are crap at the moment, ask Celtic & Arsenal 😀
GD PTS
1 Man Utd 6 2 4 0 9 3 6 10
2 Villarreal 6 2 3 1 9 7 2 9
3 AaB 6 1 3 2 9 14 -5 6
4 Celtic 6 1 2 3 4 7 -3 5
If thats a sucessful Celtic campaign.........
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Originally posted by Rooney Once a Bluethey beat villarreal which was more than utd could do.....😉
Well Mctayto, lets ask posters how crap United are compared to Celtic and Arsenal....
GD PTS
1 Man Utd 6 2 4 0 9 3 6 10
2 Villarreal 6 2 3 1 9 7 2 9
3 AaB 6 1 3 2 9 14 -5 6
4 Celtic 6 1 2 3 4 7 -3 5
If thats a sucessful Celtic campaign.........
Originally posted by trev33Not a valid comparison.
they beat villarreal which was more than utd could do.....😉
Villarreal were qualified when Celtic beat them at home, nothing to play for.
United played Villareal when they were top of the Spanish league and the game meant something.
Just checking again, yes, United finished top of the group and Celtic bottom, thanks Mctayto, Celtic and Arsenal for pointing out how bad we are.
Celtic as usual have the typical Scotish impact in the Champions League, no impact.
What a waste of a CL place it is to give the Scotish champions entry to the Champions League.
At best this should be changed to the winners of the Scotish Premiership having a playoff game against 5th place in the Premier League for a CL place.
Originally posted by Rooney Once a BlueI definitely want to see Babel starting up front alongside Keane, but as you might have noticed if you watched Liverpool beat PSV on Tuesday, Keane and Babel don't play well together. I think it's mostly Keane's fault, he tends to try these intricate give-n-go manoevres but then he runs into a pile of defenders and nobody wants to pass the ball to him because he keeps giving it back to the opposition. He really is in poor form, I would've thought that a player of his calibre was immune to a bout of low confidence but it's simply not happening.
I think Rafa played what he thought was his best side, but its frustrating a lot of LFC supporters because they want to see Babel starting and playing up front with Keane and for Keane to be given a run of 90 minute games.
Liverpools lucky season is starting to catch up with them.
Their squad is too thin, they can't break down teams that defend, so look boring to watch.
I think that you're slightly incorrect in saying that the squad is too thin. We're very deep in midfield players, almost too deep, with Mascherano and Alonso and Riera and Gerrard and Benayoun and Lucas and Pennant. Then there's the defenders, and there's too many great players to list to I won't go into detail. The real problem is that we're too thin up front. This coming January I would like to see Rafa sell Keane and buy at least two good strikers. Fingers (and toes) crossed!
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Originally posted by hopscotchI know what you're saying.
I definitely want to see Babel starting up front alongside Keane, but as you might have noticed if you watched Liverpool beat PSV on Tuesday, Keane and Babel don't play well together. I think it's mostly Keane's fault, he tends to try these intricate give-n-go manoevres but then he runs into a pile of defenders and nobody wants to pass the ball to him beca o see Rafa sell Keane and buy at least two good strikers. Fingers (and toes) crossed!
Its the way Keane plays, he's always looking for the small link up, 1-2 pass. Its a very strong part of his game, the players around him need to adapt a little to his style.
If you believe in a player though you really have to give them a strong run in the team. In about 70 or even 80% of games this season Rafa has subbed Keane. Any player would suffer a loss of confidence if this happens to them.
The same is happening to Tevez at United.
Keane must be thinking if I can't get a consistent run with Torres out, what chance do I ever have here?
As for Liverpools squad.
Yes I agree the strikers are too thin and If I supported Liverpool I would want them to sell Keane while they can still get some money for him and buy two strikers.
I have to disagree about the strength of midfield.
I can't see any world class wingers in the squad, unless you want to class Gerrard as a right winger. Riera is ok and has promise but not yet proven top 4 material as a winger. Babel has shown promise but now he plays up front and has never had a run of games, recently he seems to be going backwards, a dangerous thing for someone his age.
In the centre Liverpool are strong.
With Mascherano, Alonso and Gerrard there are all the ingredients you need (except pace) to compete at the highest levels.
Alonso has really surprised me, I think the best think Rafa did in the summer was failing to sell Alonso 🙂, he really tried to sell him.
Sorry, don't rate Benayoun or Pennant.
If Liverpool lose Gerrard then the midfield starts to look weak, so as long as he stays fit, you're in good shape.
So Liverpools midfield is strong, lacks width though but is it as strong as Uniteds?
United have played just about the entire season without 1st choice CM in Hargreaves and most of the season without 2nd choice CM in Scholes.
4th choice CM in Anderson has just been voted young player of the year and looks a terrific prospect having just turned 20.
He's dominating midfields against top players.
Then we have 3rd choice Carrick, also out for long periods and Fletcher who always plays a solid game for is in CM.
United have he best winger in the world in Ronaldo who can play left or right, Nani who is developing, giggs who is a little past it but can still do a job (seems to play CM now though) and Park who makes impacts in games with his pace, energy and passing ability.
So United have already been stretched with bad injuries in midfield but can cope with it and have both a strong centre and wing play that can open up a game, something Liverpool lack.
Thats why its a two horse race for the title, United vs Chelsea.
Everyone should look out though when Chelsea get Essien and Carvalho back.
Originally posted by hopscotchRe: relative strength in depths, check out... Thread 104618
I think that you're slightly incorrect in saying that the squad is too thin. We're very deep in midfield players, almost too deep, with Mascherano and Alonso and Riera and Gerrard and Benayoun and Lucas and Pennant. Then there's the defenders, and there's too many great players to list to I won't go into detail.
Going by your lists, Sunderland have huge strength in depth. You can't just list a load of donkeys (Penant, Benayoun) and state that a certain area has loads of cover. You're use of the term "We're very deep in..." may have been concluded slightly differently when referring to the Poo's strength in depth.
You must be joking about your defensive cover.
As I mentioned in another thread, I did a very scientific study, and the conclusion was that Liverpool won't finish within 7 points of the champions.
D
Originally posted by hopscotchThe problem with Keane ass you rightly identified is that he is a real give and go player... a player with beautiful touch and skill.
I definitely want to see Babel starting up front alongside Keane, but as you might have noticed if you watched Liverpool beat PSV on Tuesday, Keane and Babel don't play well together. I think it's mostly Keane's fault, he tends to try these intricate give-n-go manoevres but then he runs into a pile of defenders and nobody wants to pass the ball to him beca ...[text shortened]... o see Rafa sell Keane and buy at least two good strikers. Fingers (and toes) crossed!
Unfortunately, Liverpool's tactic of Hoof, Harrass, Harry and Hope (HHH&H) doesn't fit very well with the type of game Keane likes to play, where there is space in the centre due to the presence of wide men, and his team have pulled spaces in the defence of the opposition for him to exploit with his give and gos.
On the flip side, Keane is excellent at harrassing, harrying and hoping, so should still contribute indirectly to quite a few typical Liverpool goals.
D