1. SEMO
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    13 Jun '08 02:22
    The gift is free in the sense that we do not do anything in order to get it. We can not buy our salvation nor can we do anything in order to obtain salvation. The gift is for the Lord's elect, not everyone. Christ payed the price for the salvation of his elect.

    Here is a verse that is widely used to get people to think they have to "accept" Christ in order to obtain salvation.

    Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

    The word "world" in this verse is kosmos in the Greek language.

    kosmos
    kos'-mos
    Probably from the base of G2865; orderly arrangement, that is, decoration; by implication the world (in a wide or narrow sense, including its inhabitants, literally or figuratively [morally]): - adorning, world.

    In this verse kosmos is meaning the adorning, if it were meaning the world then all the world would be saved and none would go to hell as you stated with your question. However the Bible tells us that some do go to hell, therefore the word 'world' here has to mean adorning rather than world.

    The Bible teaches us that nothing we do will can get us saved. Not believing, not accepting, nothing. Belief is the cause of salvation, and it is Christ who make us acceptable. Christ has done it all for those who are predestined before the foundation of the world.

    Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
    Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

    Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
    Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
    Eph 1:6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
    Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
    Eph 1:8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
    Eph 1:9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
    Eph 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
    Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
  2. Standard memberDoctorScribbles
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    13 Jun '08 03:12
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    The gift is free in the sense that we do not do anything in order to get it. We can not buy our salvation nor can we do anything in order to obtain salvation. The gift is for the Lord's elect, not everyone. Christ payed the price for the salvation of his elect.

    Here is a verse that is widely used to get people to think they have to "accept" Christ in o ...[text shortened]... ccording to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
    Bitchin'. Are you part of the elect?
  3. SubscriberAThousandYoung
    Just another day
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    13 Jun '08 03:132 edits
    Does this mean I'm saved too? I'm an atheist who dislikes religion and opposes religious influence as a hobby. I usually target Christianity because it's so influential in my nation.
  4. SEMO
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    13 Jun '08 03:41
    Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
    Bitchin'. Are you part of the elect?
    See for yorself if I am. Test my fruits with what the Lord's Word says.

    Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

    Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
    Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

    1Jn 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
  5. weedhopper
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    13 Jun '08 03:51
    Absolutely free. Saved by grace alone through faith in Christ,
    This will surely restart the centuries-long debate over "cheap grace", but {sigh} carry on...
  6. Standard memberscottishinnz
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    13 Jun '08 06:25
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    The gift is free in the sense that we do not do anything in order to get it.
    That's not what Jebus said......
  7. Cape Town
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    13 Jun '08 06:25
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    In this verse kosmos is meaning the adorning, if it were meaning the world then all the world would be saved and none would go to hell as you stated with your question. However the Bible tells us that some do go to hell, therefore the word 'world' here has to mean adorning rather than world.
    Thats streatching logic a bit.
    Odd that throughout the centuaries most people have been able to interpret it as 'world' without seeing any contradiction.
  8. Standard memberscottishinnz
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    13 Jun '08 06:29
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    See for yorself if I am.
    OK!

    Give me $100.
  9. Joined
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    13 Jun '08 14:18
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    See for yorself if I am. Test my fruits with what the Lord's Word says.

    Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

    Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
    Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the wil ...[text shortened]... y the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
    This post and your previous post appear to be at odds. On the one hand you seem to be advocating the idea that it's not necessary to overcome sin for salvation and yet you also seem to recognize that one must "doeth the will of my Father" and that one can be judged by his fruits.

    Matthew 7:17-18
    "So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit."

    Does the "will of my Father" include acts of sin? Is an act of sin "good fruit" or "bad fruit".
  10. Joined
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    13 Jun '08 14:26
    Originally posted by pritybetta
    Is Salvation a free gift?
    No it is not free. You have to sell your soul for it.
  11. Standard memberknightmeister
    knightmeister
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    13 Jun '08 22:17
    Originally posted by scottishinnz
    That's not what Jebus said......
    But it is what Jesus said! LOL
  12. Standard memberscottishinnz
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    14 Jun '08 05:49
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    But it is what Jesus said! LOL
    Actually, I believe ha said something along the lines of, "not all those who call me lord will reach my father." He specifically said it's not enough to believe, but one must LIVE the way he specifies.

    Let's run a little experiment.


    Give me $100.
  13. Standard memberknightmeister
    knightmeister
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    14 Jun '08 08:06
    Originally posted by scottishinnz
    Actually, I believe ha said something along the lines of, "not all those who call me lord will reach my father." He specifically said it's not enough to believe, but one must LIVE the way he specifies.

    Let's run a little experiment.


    Give me $100.
    No , he specifically said that its not enough to shallowly mouth the words "lord" and then go out and collect browny points in the hope that it will get you into heaven. That's not true belief.
  14. Standard memberscottishinnz
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    14 Jun '08 13:56
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    No , he specifically said that its not enough to shallowly mouth the words "lord" and then go out and collect browny points in the hope that it will get you into heaven. That's not true belief.
    No $100?

    Well, I can only concluse that you DO NOT follow the teachings of Jesus. Jesus said, if someone asks you for something, don't ask why, just give it to them.

    He also said that collecting material things in this world was evil. So KM, own your own house? Not a Christian. Got a car, or a savings account? Not a Christian. How about a pension scheme? Sorry, off to the hot place for you......
  15. Standard memberknightmeister
    knightmeister
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    14 Jun '08 15:31
    Originally posted by scottishinnz
    No $100?

    Well, I can only concluse that you DO NOT follow the teachings of Jesus. Jesus said, if someone asks you for something, don't ask why, just give it to them.

    He also said that collecting material things in this world was evil. So KM, own your own house? Not a Christian. Got a car, or a savings account? Not a Christian. How about a pension scheme? Sorry, off to the hot place for you......
    bait not taken.....
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