Originally posted by sonshipPaul did not say that Christ is the Firstborn of all creation BECAUSE He was the first thing God created - Jaywill
A JW challenge:
[quote] Colossians 1:15 states with regard to Jesus, 'the firstborn of all creation'. You and your dishonest cohorts have attempted to state that the term firstborn is not made with reference to progeny when in fact up until this point it is used more than thirty times in the Bible with regard to progeny. You have attempted to state that ...[text shortened]... e among everything in the universe. His actions agree with Paul's teaching in [b]Colossians.[/b]
Paul stated Jesus is the first-born of all creation because he was the first entity directly created by God. There is no other way to interpret the scripture. The Bible itself determines that Jesus is the first-born of all creation that is what the term 'of creation', means and you cannot escape it with your pagan doctrine.
I never even read the rest of your mumbo jumbo because personally I am sick of your lies.
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Originally posted by robbie carrobieAs you can see with Robbie jaywill is sonship and sonship is jaywill - which I completely explained long ago when I changed tags.
I never even read the rest of your mumbo jumbo because personally I am sick of your lies.[/b]
Jesus is God and God is Jesus in the Bible.
It is too bad a Watchtower disciple like Robbie grasps the former and cannot see in Scripture the latter.
Originally posted by sonshipmore emptiness.
As you can see with Robbie [b] jaywill is sonship and sonship is jaywill - which I completely explained long ago when I changed tags.
Jesus is God and God is Jesus in the Bible.
It is too bad a Watchtower disciple like Robbie grasps the former and cannot see in Scripture the latter.[/b]
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Then find better uses of your time than reading what I write.
Goodbye then and Jesus loves you. But I rebuked your preaching of "another Jesus".
Back then to Matt 7:21-23.
"I never knew you" uses that same Greek word as when Paul said in Romans 7:15 - that he does not acknowledge what he does.
For what I work out, I do not acknowledge ..." (Rom. 7:15)
Christ will say that He never approved of, never acknowledged, the lawless methods done in His name yet not according to the Father's will.
The same concept of Christ judging His saved saints in taught in First Corinthians 3.
" If anyone's work which he has built upon the foundation remains, he will receive a reward.
If anyone's work is consumed, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire." (1 Cor. 3:14,15)
Suffer loss but be saved.
Be saved but lose a reward.
Be saved yet so as through fire.
This applies to Matt. 7:21-23 which is about the judgment of Christian workers.
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Originally posted by sonshipyou did nothing but do what you always do, promote your own propaganda. I demonstrated why you are arrogant, presumptuous and cannot get to know Jesus as a consequence. Your idolatry and paganism are also a stumbling block.
Then find better uses of your time than reading what I write.
Goodbye then and Jesus loves you. But I rebuked your preaching of [b]"another Jesus".
Back then to Matt 7:21-23.
"I never knew you" uses that same Greek word as when Paul said in Romans 7:15 - that he does not acknowledge what he does.
[quote] For wh ...[text shortened]... fire.
This applies to [b]Matt. 7:21-23 which is about the judgment of Christian workers.[/b]
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Jesus spoke the word of Matthew 7:21-23 at the conclusion of a long discourse that began in chapter 5. This has been called the sermon on the mount.
The sermon begins with 5:1 -
And when He saw the crowds, He went up to the mountain. And after He sat down, His disciples came to Him,
And opening His mouth, He taught the, saying
Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of the heavens. (Matt. 5:1-3)
1.) The word is not to "the crowds".
2.) Those who were His disciples came up FROM the crowds higher, to hear Him.
3.) Then to THIS group of "His disciples" He opened His mouth and taught.
All the teaching from 5:3 through to 7:27 are to be taken as Christ's word to His disciples.
The section finishes with these words in 7:28,29 -
And when Jesus finished these words, the crowds were astounded at His teaching. For He taught them as One having authority and not like their scribes.
But we must remember that His words were directed at "His disciples" (5:1) who came up a little higher to Him. Based upon this we should understand the judgment of Matt. 7:21-23 to be concerning Christians.
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Some verses on the calling by God of Moses to be His servant.
And Jehovah said to him, What is that in your hand? And he said, A staff. And He said, Throw it on the ground. And he threw it on the ground, and it became a serpent; and Moses recoiled from it.
And Jehovah said to Moses, Stretch out your hand, and take it by its tail - so he stretched out his hand and seized it, and it became a staff in his hand - (Exodus 4:2-4)
God exposed the true nature hidden in all of Moses's attainments from the world as to what they really are. That is something to recoil from in the light of God and God's will.
After seeing what was its true nature, he was commanded to pick it up by the tail. That is with a caution as to what it really is. And it became a staff again. God's revelation changes our outlook on all of our worldly training.
He does not demand we destroy it all. He does command that we have a proper realization of its true nature and use it in a sanctified manner.
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Then the heart of God's leader is exposed as to its need for salvation.
And Jehovah further said to him, Now put your hand into your bosom. And he put his hand into his bosom, and when he took it out, there his hand was, leprous like snow.
And He said, Put your hand into your bosom again - so he put his hand into his bosom again, and when he took it out of his bosom, there it was, restored like the rest of his flesh - (Exodus 4:6,7)
This sign shows that God must reveal to man the terribly diseased condition of his heart. But thanks to His salvation He can cure it. He can save the heart of man from its Satanified and sickened sinful condition.
This great leader of God's people had to have these two signs as a type to ALL of those who would lead God's people.
The only perfect leader to exist is of course the Son of God - Jesus Christ. He bore the sins of the whole world that we might be saved.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieAbsolutely not.
my rank hypocrisy? you mean my rank awesomeness surely?😵
I mean you penchant for using the 'making it personal' angle when you are facing difficult question which you don't want to answer, and then a few days later here you are 'making it personal' when you are giving someone a grilling.
Originally posted by Proper Knobmy penchant for making it personal? i provided much rationality and simply ended my text with an insult which formed no part of my argument, that you chose to ignore the former and emphasise the latter is rather telling.
Absolutely not.
I mean you penchant for using the 'making it personal' angle when you are facing difficult question which you don't want to answer, and then a few days later here you are 'making it personal' when you are giving someone a grilling.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI don't dispute you had a valid argument, never have done. There are remarks in your post though which can undeniably be classified as 'making it personal', you have even conceded this point in an earlier post.
my penchant for making it personal? i provided much rationality and simply ended my text with an insult which formed no part of my argument, that you chose to ignore the former and emphasise the latter is rather telling.
You lament other posters for 'making it personal' and here you are doing exactly the same thing. That makes you a hypocrite.