Originally posted by galveston75Mighty God ? Almighty God ? ummmmmmmm splitting hairs my friend 🙂
Not important? I bullit speading by your head only millimeters from missing you by a split hair, I think that would make a differance wouldn't you?
Or a misspelled surgery oder by your doctor wouldn't be cool either.
Manny
PS: I surprised that the New World Translation does not read "A Mighty God"
To support their twisted doctrine.
Also why and how can the son be called Eternal father ? Answer that G-75 and RC if you can. The Child the Son will be called.........these names
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Manny
2 edits
Originally posted by RJHindshow would you know what i know and what i dont know? that is correct, you dont, so
Maybe, you should learn to use proper capitalization in sentences
before you start judging someones typing errors. My text has to
do with the fact that you do not know these orignal languages as
you claim. You are only taking the word of those you choose to
believe. This is the same thing you accused me of doing, but I
admitted I did not know the original languages well. Why do you
not admit the same?
SHUT UP A YO FACE,
there is that capitalised enough for you.
I even produced the edition from which i learnt to read and write Koine, New Testament
Greek by D.F. Hudson, ISBN 0 340 26648 1, you may wish to purchase it yourself. As
for your text, it has more spelling inaccuracies, for example orignal, is actually spelt
original. Suck it up RJH. you may know how to load a rifle, but you canny read Greek,
so nah nah nah nah nah.
Originally posted by menace71Ill let the Gman handle all questions of a theological nature, i am interested in the base texts.
Also why and how can the son be called Eternal father ? Answer that G-75 and RC if you can. The Child the Son will be called.........these names
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Manny
2 edits
Originally posted by robbie carrobieIt is the other way around. One has to experience God to grow in the full knowledge of God.
the problem with your argument Jaywill is that not all references to spirit are
necessarily the Holy spirit, once again i tell you truly, if you want to understand what
type of spirit is being referenced in the text, you must examine the text in the original
language. There is no substitute for this, you cannot gain accurate knowledge of
scripture through a mystical experience.
"But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." (2 Pet. 3:18)
No. That does not mean merely collect more Greek and Hebrew lexicons and dictionaries in your office.
You are using the phrase "mystical experience" as a perjorative. You are using the phrase in a deragatory and negative connotation to express contempt for the Christian experience.
I have not been pushing "mystical experience" for 500 posts. I used the phrase "mystical Body of Christ" perhaps a few times.
But it is through experience and the Scripture we grow in grace and in the full knowledge of the Son of God.
And it is by faith that we make more room for the living Christ to make His home in our hearts.
"That Christ may make His home in your hearts through faith" (Eph. 3:17)
How can you by faith allow Christ to make His home in your heart ? You think He is the angel Michael. This is according to the original language of ENGLISH and the lies told by Charles Russell and Judge Rutherford.
That is the original English language errors spread by the Watchtower Magazine.
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Originally posted by robbie carrobieThis may be helpful to your propaganda on Isaiah 9:6; but note
Ill let the Gman handle all questions of a theological nature, i am interested in the base texts.
that verse 7 is also important in understanding that this is not
talking about a mere human that lives forever.
http://www.answering-islam.org/BibleCom/is9-6.html
P.S. Here is a translation of the Qumran Isaiah scroll:
http://www.ao.net/~fmoeller/qa-tran.htm
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Originally posted by jaywillThis has nothing to do with The Watchtower and Bible tract society of Pennsylvania
It is the other way around. One has to experience God to grow in the full knowledge of God.
[b]"But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." (2 Pet. 3:18)
No. That does not mean merely collect more Greek and Hebrew lexicons and dictionaries in your office.
You are using the phrase "mystical experience" as a per That is the original English language errors spread by the Watchtower Magazine.[/b]
incorporated, what you are in fact doing is attempting to substitute some kind of
emotionalism for hard work and study. Even the great King Solomon, forefather of
the Christ states,
(Proverbs 2:1-5) . . .My son, if you will receive my sayings and treasure up my own
commandments with yourself, so as to pay attention to wisdom with your ear, that
you may incline your heart to discernment; if, moreover, you call out for
understanding itself and you give forth your voice for discernment itself, if you
keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it,
in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very
knowledge of God. . .
You will note that knowledge of God requires effort on our part, indeed, i am sure if
one was to find a literal treasure hidden in the sand one would exert themselves
trying to dig it out, how more so , the very knowledge of God. Emotionalism
produces weak and wimpy, washy Christians, who have no root to their faith and
when challenged to explain it, become emotional, for their faith is not based on
reason, but emotionalism. This is the legacy of the churches of Christendom and
they are reprehensible for it.
Originally posted by RJHindswhatever Yankee doodle, you keep placating your self with whatever reasons you find
This may be helpful to your propaganda on Isaiah 9:6; but note
that verse 7 is also important in understanding that this is not
talking about a mere human that lives forever.
http://www.answering-islam.org/BibleCom/is9-6.html
P.S. Here is a translation of the Qumran Isaiah scroll:
http://www.ao.net/~fmoeller/qa-tran.htm
it necessary to negate the ancient text.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYou said you were only interested in what the text actually says, so I
whatever Yankee doodle, you keep placating your self with whatever reasons you find
it necessary to negate the ancient text.
was trying to help you out. Do you say that "Mighty God" should not
be in the text?
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Originally posted by RJHindsI have demonstrated , with reference to the Hebrew text, that it is in the text. I have
You said you were only interested in what the text actually says, so I
was trying to help you out. Do you say that "Mighty God" should not
be in the text?
never disputed that its not in the text, are you feeling ok RJH?
Originally posted by menace71No problem, I will but I have an observation my friend. You come up with these questions, which are good questions for sure, and then we answer them and more then not I hear no responce from you on most. Just wondering if we're answering them for you satisfactory or not? Most you don't seem to respond too.
Also why and how can the son be called Eternal father ? Answer that G-75 and RC if you can. The Child the Son will be called.........these names
For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Manny
5 edits
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThe Jehovah's Witness writes:
Isaiah does not call Jesus Almighty God, does he, nooo, he doesn't, for we know this
when we examine the original language text, its divesgeester that says Jesus is
Almighty God, not Isaiah. why? because he wishes to impose his dogma upon the text,
where none exists, that is why.
Isaiah does not call Jesus Almighty God, does he, nooo, he doesn't, for we know this when we examine the original language text, its divesgeester that says Jesus is Almighty God, not Isaiah. why? because he wishes to impose his dogma upon the text, where none exists, that is why.
Of course the name "Jesus" is not mentioned in the prophecy.
Who else in the universe qualifies to be the recipient of such a promise. Hezekiah ? Jesus said something greater than the temple, Solomon, and David were here when He was here. That should go for Hezekiah too. All of the figures with psotive aspects in the Old Testament are shadows and pointers to Jesus Christ.
The child born who is the Mighty God is of course the Lord Jesus.
The Son given who is the Eternal Father is of course the Lord Jesus.
The Prince of Peace is of course Jesus, the Prince of life.
And all government is being headed up in Him as God outworks His will in the earth.
We do not need to see the word "JESUS" mentioned in either Isaiah 9:6 or Isaiah 53 or in many other place prophesying of the coming of Christ.
Now to a particular problem. Beside the Father of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is there ANOTHER Divine and Eternal Father in the universe ?
Is there a CLEAR link between the Father of the Old Testament and the Father of Whom Jesus spoke ? Is there a clear connection informing us that the Father of whom Jesus spoke, obeyed, prayed to, submitted to, and manifested is that Eternal Father of Isaiah 9:6 ?
Yes. Here is a strong link between the Father of the Old Testament and the "Father" spoken of and manifested in Jesus of the New Testament:
"Jesus said to them, IF God were your Father you would love Me; for I came forth out from God and have come [from Him]; " (John 8:42)
There is no doubt that by "Father" Jesus is speaking of the God, the ONLY God known to the Jews. That is the God Jehovah who was always called thier Father -
"But now Jehovah, You are our Father; . .." (Isa. 64:8)
"For You are our Father ... You, Jehovah, are our Father ..." (Isa. 63:16)
Jesus is saying in John 8:42 that though God was the Eternal Divine Father to Israel, they are not acting accordingly towards Him (Jesus).
"Jesus said to them, If God were your Father you would love Me; for I came forth out from God ..."
The Jews said before " ... we have one Father, God." (John 8:41)
So, there is a great mystery here. It is not a mystery of the invention of "trinitarians". It is the mystery presented by the Holy Bible. You have to blame Jesus for this mytery. You have to blame the whole Bible for this mystery. You cannot blame Athanasius, or Origen, or Justin Martyr, or Ireneaus or any of the early century Christian teachers.
The blame for this puzzle has to be put on the One who ACTED like God, and SAID He was the Father. He said the Father lived in Him and He in the Father. He said to have seen Him was to have seen the Father. He is the one you have to blame.
We Christians just believe what is written. The child born is the Mighty God. The Son given is the Father of eternity - the Everlasting Father (Isa. 9:6)
Some will protest then:
But HOW can the one, a man, praying to His Father, obeying His Father, BE also His Father ??
I don't know.
But I do know that when Jesus came into my heart God was no longer simply a great Creator to me. He also at that moment and ever since became my Daddy, my Father:
"And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, Abba, Father!" (Gal. 4:6)
And if the ancient brothers decided that the word "Trinity" was a necessary word to defend such a truth against the ancient anti-Christ false teachers like Arius, that is good.
Now let's to Philip's problem with a Father he needed to see apart from the man Jesus Christ:
"Philip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father and it is sufficient for us." (John 14:8)
A reasonable request this is from a human standpoint. "Jesus, for three years now you have been teaching about Your Father. SHOW us now the Father and that is good enough to convince us of the reality of this Father of Yours."
Jesus' answer:
"Jesus said to him [Philip], Have I been so long a time with you, and you have not ... known ... ME ... Philip?
He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how is it that you say, Show us the Father ?
Do you not believe that the I am in the Father and the Father is in Me ? The words that I say to you I do not speak from Myself, but the Father who abides in Me does His works.
Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me; but if not, believe because of the works themselves." (John 14: 9-11)