A REAL relationship with God.

Originally posted by Rajk999
If your interpretation of what SAVED means is correct, then there would have been no reason for Paul, Peter, James, John and Jude to constantly, over and over, warn the SAVED Christian saints that they MUST continue with good works and righteous living otherwise they will not enter the Kingdom of God.

Saved and eternal life are two different things.

You have no clue, I do not believe in once saved always saved, that I can live in sin and
just go on as if nothing I do matters. Many walk away from the Lord, it is those walking with
Him to the end doing His will that will not be cast into the lake of fire. I agree there would
be no need for warnings about turning away from God if it couldn't happen. Yet those that
do come to Christ from that point on are right with God and will be even at judgement day.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Jesus likes those who do good works and according to Him, it is these people who will enter the Kingdom of God. Those who think they are saved and do nothing, they will be cast into the lake of fire.

Jesus told his followers that the Holy Spirit was going to come to teach us about Him, and
yet you deny that as needed or required. You stand against people getting right with God
the way Jesus and everyone in scripture talked about, by saying it is an earned thing by
works, and you will find that you'll never be able to do enough good works to earn your
way in. You reject the scriptures that say if you do not believe in Jesus you are condemn
already, you reject the scriptures that say if you do not have God's Spirit you do not
belong to God. You stand in judgment of scripture, if it doesn't fit your earn your way to
God by works doctrine it isn't good enough for you.

Originally posted by KellyJay
You have no clue, I do not believe in once saved always saved, that I can live in sin and
just go on as if nothing I do matters. Many walk away from the Lord, it is those walking with
Him to the end doing His will that will not be cast into the lake of fire. I agree there would
be no need for warnings about turning away from God if it couldn't happen. Ye ...[text shortened]... that
do come to Christ from that point on are right with God and will be even at judgement day.

This is a figment of your imagination: Yet those that do come to Christ from that point on are right with God and will be even at judgement day.

It is not in the Bible.

The only reason why someone would argue so vehemently against doing good works is someone who hates good works. If you hate good works, you hate Christ, if you hate Christ you hate God. Yet you want God to give you eternal life ... pathetic.

Originally posted by Rajk999
This is a figment of your imagination: Yet those that do come to Christ from that point on are right with God and will be even at judgement day.

It is not in the Bible.

The only reason why someone would argue so vehemently against doing good works is someone who hates good works. If you hate good works, you hate Christ, if you hate Christ you hate God. Yet you want God to give you eternal life ... pathetic.

Really, did you read the Bible? They are going to stand in front of God and when the books
are open if their names are in the book of life they will be saved. What is it that God is
looking at when He judges? If you do not have God's Spirit you do not belong to God, if you
do have God's Spirit you'll be doing the works of God. Your the one that wants to say that
Jesus and believing in Him isn't important, that lie the serpent would be proud of, anyone
who believes that will have a spot in the lake of fire when they think they were good
enough due to the works they did here alone apart from Jesus Christ and God's Holy
Spirit.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Really, did you read the Bible? They are going to stand in front of God and when the books
are open if their names are in the book of life they will be saved. What is it that God is
looking at when He judges? If you do not have God's Spirit you do not belong to God, if you
do have God's Spirit you'll be doing the works of God. Your the one that wants to ...[text shortened]... ood
enough due to the works they did here alone apart from Jesus Christ and God's Holy
Spirit.

Examine yourself .. why is it that you speak so negatively about good works and righteous living, when Jesus spoke so highly of them, even stating that those who live as such will enter the Kingdom of God. Something is sadly wrong with you.

Originally posted by Rajk999
If your interpretation of what SAVED means is correct, then there would have been no reason for Paul, Peter, James, John and Jude to constantly, over and over, warn the SAVED Christian saints that they MUST continue with good works and righteous living otherwise they will not enter the Kingdom of God.

Saved and eternal life are two different things.

One of the things from which fallen man needs to be SAVED from is spiritual death.
That is a comatose and deadened human spirit damaged by the fall of Adam.

So when the spiritual death is overcome by Christ imparting forgiveness and life into the innermost human spirit, the man is SAVED from spiritual death.

"And you, though dead in your offenses and in the uncircumcision of your flesh,

He made ALIVE together with Him, having forgiven us all our offenses." (Col. 2:13)

1.) Notice that this is a being saved from spiritual DEATH.
2.) Notice that this being saved is being MADE ALIVE.
3.) Notice that this being "MADE ALIVE" is absolutely concurrent with God having "forgivien us all our offenses".

The being "MADE ALIVE" is made alive with eternal life.
As soon as forgiveness is secured the sinner receives this enlivening.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Examine yourself .. why is it that you speak so negatively about good works and righteous living, when Jesus spoke so highly of them, even stating that those who live as such will enter the Kingdom of God. Something is sadly wrong with you.

You should read what I actually said. There was nothing I said negatively about works or righteous living. You again are twisting words to suit you not seeing what is there.

Originally posted by sonship
One of the things from which fallen man needs to be SAVED from is spiritual death.
That is a comatose and deadened human spirit damaged by the fall of Adam.

So when the spiritual death is overcome by Christ imparting forgiveness and life into the innermost human spirit, the man is SAVED from spiritual death.

[quote] [b] "And you, though dead in you ...[text shortened]... h [b]eternal life.
As soon as forgiveness is secured the sinner receives this enlivening.[/b]

Of course, everyone is forgiven. BUT :

NOTICE : There is a limit to forgiveness. Nobody has the privilege of continuing on in sin and disobedience and still entering the Kingdom of God.

Did you NOTICE all the warnings from Paul, from John, from Peter and from Jude?

NOTICE THEM.

Originally posted by KellyJay
You should read what I actually said. There was nothing I said negatively about works or righteous living. You again are twisting words to suit you not seeing what is there.

Can you repeat what Jesus said about good works and righteous living?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Of course, everyone is forgiven. BUT :

NOTICE : There is a limit to forgiveness. Nobody has the privilege of continuing on in sin and disobedience and still entering the Kingdom of God.

Did you NOTICE all the warnings from Paul, from John, from Peter and from Jude?

NOTICE THEM.

Of course, everyone is forgiven.
-------------------------------------------------

Then you are saying that Col. 2:12 teaches that everyone has been made alive.

" ... made alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our offenses."

That cannot be right.


BUT :

NOTICE : There is a limit to forgiveness.
------------------------------------------------------------

When Paul says " all our offenses" he does not mean "ALL our offenses" ?

" ... having forgiven us ALL ... our offenses."

There's something wrong with your thought there that "all" means some offenses have not been forgiven.


Nobody has the privilege of continuing on in sin and disobedience and still entering the Kingdom of God.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How many times have you seen me over the years expound
three passages which say that certain life styles will exclude ones from inheriting the kingdom of God?

These passages that I have expounded are First Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21; Ephesians 5:5 ?

All three of these passages you should have seen me explain numerous times over the years. The three passages -

1.) Are addressed to Christians
2.) Conclude respectively with this warning -

First Corinthians 6:10 " ... will not inherit the kingdom of God"

Galatians 5:21 " ... even as I have said before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God."

Ephesian 5:5 " ... For this you realize ... has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God."

Three times at least Paul specifically warns Christians that certain unforsaken lifestyles will cause the believer to not be able to inherit the kingdom of God.

Yet to see the kingdom of God one must be born again.

"Jesus answered and said to him, truly, truly, I say to you, Unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God." (John 3:3)

There is no contradiction. The kingdom of God has its stages. One may participate in one initial stage but be unqualified to participate in a further developed stage until that one is dispositionally sanctified.

This passages is one that proves that there could be sections or stages of the kingdom of God.

" And He said, So is the kingdom of God: as if a man cast seed on the earth, And sleeps and rises night and day, and the seed sprouts and lengthens - how, he does not know. The earth bears fruit by itself: first a blade, then an ear, then full grain in the ear.
But when the fruit is ripe, immediately he sends forth the sickle, because the harvest has come." (Mark 4:26-29)

Ie.
The kingdom of God has its sprout stage.
The kingdom of God has its blade stage.
The kingdom of God develops more to its ear stage.
The kingdom of God develops more to its full grain in the ear stage.
The kingdom of God develops further into its ripe stage.
The kingdom of God climaxes into its harvest stage.

All along the way it is the kingdom of God. And one may participate in one stage but fail to participate in a further stage until he or she matures to be qualified for that stage.

The Christians so warned in the three passages are in danger of not being sanctified dispositionally to be qualified to inherit the kingdom of God in its stage as the millennial kingdom reward upon the earth after Christ's second coming.

All teaching of the New Testament implies that they arrive to the eternal kingdom, yet in some cases LATE. All who are born again WILL arrive. Not all will arrive to participate on time in the stage of the kingdom of God which is the millennial kingdom.

I have explained this over that last six to eight years before probably about five times.


Did you NOTICE all the warnings from Paul, from John, from Peter and from Jude?

NOTICE THEM.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You know that they have not escaped my notice.

Originally posted by sonship
[b] Of course, everyone is forgiven.
-------------------------------------------------

Then you are saying that Col. 2:12 teaches that everyone has been made alive.

" ... made alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our offenses."

That cannot be right.


BUT :

NOTICE : There is a limit t ...[text shortened]... ----------------------------------------------

You know that they have not escaped my notice.

If you take what the writings of Christ and the Apostles say in full you would not spend all that time writing and explaining:

Why did Christ die and what sins did he die for?
Here is the answer:

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. (Romans 3:23-26 KJV)

Christ died for sins that are past ... PAST .... not all. Its ALL up to the point in time when someone accepts Christ. Then ALL past sins are forgiven up to that point. Going forward failure to live rightesously can be fatal.

The Bible is clear that beyond that point, forgiveness continues but not forever. There is a limit and this is explained clearly in the Bible but I know you do not accept the Apostles teaching so I wont waste my time further.

There is no assurance of forgiveness, or no guarantee of forgiveness after accepting Christ.

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, (Hebrews 10:26 KJV)

Originally posted by Rajk999
Can you repeat what Jesus said about good works and righteous living?

Repeat what you claim I said against them.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Repeat what you claim I said against them.

You said works and following commandments is trying to earn your salvation. Did Jesus say that?

If jesus is worth following, it is about good people.

Originally posted by Rajk999
If you take what the writings of Christ and the Apostles say in full you would not spend all that time writing and explaining:

Why did Christ die and what sins did he die for?
Here is the answer:

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath ...[text shortened]... the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, (Hebrews 10:26 KJV)

There is no assurance of forgiveness, or no guarantee of forgiveness after accepting Christ.

For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, (Hebrews 10:26 KJV)[/b]

So what hope does anyone have? You, me, others in this forum, the Christian world at large? If there is no assurance of forgiveness and no guarantee if sin is committed after accepting Christ? Can you answer this question? Can anyone be saved?