First i must apologise to Whodey who raised this question for it was asked in sincerity
(i think) and was met with a rather abrupt answer not becoming a servant of the
most high, therefore one shall endeavour to treat this with as much reasonableness
as is possible under the circumstances.
(Jude 9) But when Michael the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was
disputing about Moses’ body, he did not dare to bring a judgement against him in
abusive terms, but said: “May Jehovah rebuke you.”
(1 Thessalonians 4:16) because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a
commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who
are dead in union with Christ will rise first.
Is Jesus Christ the same person as Michael the archangel?
The name of this Michael appears only five times in the Bible. The glorious spirit
person who bears the name is referred to as “one of the chief princes,” “the great
prince who has charge of your [Daniel’s] people,” and as “the archangel.” (Dan.
10:13; 12:1; Jude 9, RS) Michael means “Who Is Like God?”
At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 (RS), the command of Jesus Christ for the resurrection to
begin is described as “the archangel’s call,” and Jude 9 says that the archangel is
Michael. Would it be appropriate to liken Jesus’ commanding call to that of someone
lesser in authority? Reasonably, then, the archangel Michael is Jesus Christ.
(Interestingly, the expression “archangel” is never found in the plural in the
Scriptures, thus implying that there is only one.)
Revelation 12:7-12 says that Michael and his angels would war against Satan and
hurl him and his wicked angels out of heaven in connection with the conferring of
kingly authority on Christ. Jesus is later depicted as leading the armies of heaven in
war against the nations of the world. (Rev. 19:11-16) Is it not reasonable that Jesus
would also be the one to take action against the one he described as “ruler of this
world,” Satan the Devil? (John 12:31) Daniel 12:1 (RS) associates the ‘standing up
of Michael’ to act with authority with “a time of trouble, such as never has been
since there was a nation till that time.” That would certainly fit the experience of the
nations when Christ as heavenly executioner takes action against them. So the
evidence indicates that the Son of God was known as Michael before he came to
earth and is known also by that name since his return to heaven where he resides
as the glorified spirit Son of God.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieJude 9 does not mention "Jehovah". It is the Lord, which is Jesus.
First i must apologise to Whodey who raised this question for it was asked in sincerity
(i think) and was met with a rather abrupt answer not becoming a servant of the
most high, therefore one shall endeavour to treat this with as much reasonableness
as is possible under the circumstances.
(Jude 9) But when Michael the archangel had a differe ...[text shortened]... o by that name since his return to heaven where he resides
as the glorified spirit Son of God.
P.S. Jude 1:9
But Michael the archangel, when he disputed with the devil and argued about
the body of Moses, did not dare pronounce against him a railing judgment, but
said, “The Lord rebuke you!”
Originally posted by RJHindsstart your own thread entitled 'the restoration of the divine name', this is about Michael
Jude 9 does not mention "Jehovah". It is the Lord, which is Jesus.
P.S. Jude 1:9
But Michael the archangel, when he disputed with the devil and argued about
the body of Moses, did not dare pronounce against him a railing judgment, but
said, “The Lord rebuke you!”
the archangel.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieVery Good ... 2 vague verses + 2 Assumptions = FACTUAL CONCLUSION
First i must apologise to Whodey who raised this question for it was asked in sincerity
(i think) and was met with a rather abrupt answer not becoming a servant of the
most high, therefore one shall endeavour to treat this with as much reasonableness
as is possible under the circumstances.
(Jude 9) But when Michael the archangel had a differe ...[text shortened]... o by that name since his return to heaven where he resides
as the glorified spirit Son of God.
JWs and Trinitarians have much in common.
When will people just accept the teaching of Christ and Paul and just take it how it reads? The answer? Pure Human Arrogance .. that little voice that tells you that you need to show people that you know more than they do. Even if your analysis and conclusions are pure BS.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieAgain, the devil *took Him to a very high mountain and *showed Him all the kingdoms
start your own thread entitled 'the restoration of the divine name', this is about Michael
the archangel.
of the world and their glory; and he said to Him, “All these things I will give You,
if You fall down and worship me.” Then Jesus *said to him, “Go, Satan! For it is written, ‘YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD, AND SERVE HIM ONLY.’” Then the devil
left Him; and behold, angels came and began to minister to Him.
(Matthew 4:8-11 NASB)
And Jesus rebuked him, and the demon came out of him, and the boy was cured at once.
(Matthew 17:18 NASB)
For it is written,
“AS I LIVE, SAYS THE LORD, EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW TO ME,
AND EVERY TONGUE SHALL GIVE PRAISE TO GOD.”
(Romans 14:11 NASB)
For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is
above every name, so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess
that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
(Phillipians 2:9-11 NASB)
...that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart
that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; for with the heart a person
believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting
in salvation. For the Scripture says, “WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED.” For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same
Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; for “WHOEVER
WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”
(Romans 10:9-13 NASB)
Originally posted by Rajk999As you have proffered no alternative can i assume that you dont know who the
Very Good ... 2 vague verses + 2 Assumptions = FACTUAL CONCLUSION
JWs and Trinitarians have much in common.
When will people just accept the teaching of Christ and Paul and just take it how it reads? The answer? Pure Human Arrogance .. that little voice that tells you that you need to show people that you know more than they do. Even if your analysis and conclusions are pure BS.
archangel is? as far as i can discern we have simply utilised the scriptures to form
some concrete conclusions, which of those conclusions is erroneous and on what
basis? You say that its BS but as per usual you FAIL to say why.
Originally posted by RJHindswhat has this got to do with Michael the archangel? As far as i can discern, you have
Again, the devil *took Him to a very high mountain and *showed Him all the kingdoms
of the world and their glory; and he said to Him, “All these things I will give You,
if You fall down and worship me.” Then Jesus *said to him, “Go, Satan! For it is written, ‘YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD, AND SERVE HIM ONLY.’” Then the devil
left Him; and behold, ...[text shortened]... n Him; for “WHOEVER
WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”
(Romans 10:9-13 NASB)
made two attempts at this post, with no relevance to the subject at hand in either of
them. If you want to start your own threads on different subjects please do so, but this
is about Michael the archangel.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThis is an interesting claim. What do you make of the first chapter of Hebrews?
First i must apologise to Whodey who raised this question for it was asked in sincerity
(i think) and was met with a rather abrupt answer not becoming a servant of the
most high, therefore one shall endeavour to treat this with as much reasonableness
as is possible under the circumstances.
(Jude 9) But when Michael the archangel had a differe ...[text shortened]... o by that name since his return to heaven where he resides
as the glorified spirit Son of God.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieMichael is the Archangel .
As you have proffered no alternative can i assume that you dont know who the
archangel is? as far as i can discern e have simply utilised the scriptures to form
some concrete conclusions, which o those conclusions is erroneous and on what
basis? You say that its BS but as per usual you FAIL to say why.
Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
What is the issue ?
Originally posted by bbarrYes Conrau brought the matter up once where he essentially attempted the argument that
This is an interesting claim. What do you make of the first chapter of Hebrews?
which one of the angels has God likened to his son, or words to that effect, however, it
seems to me that we are not talking of any common angel, but a unique and singular
entity, foremost above all angels. Could this be a description of the Christ? we have
no objection to this idea because to us Christ is an angel (from angelos, a sent one), a
created entity (Col 1:15) and a son of God (as were the other angelic creatures).
Originally posted by Rajk999There is no issue, as far as i can discern, we have made a connection between Christ
Michael is the Archangel .
Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
What is the issue ?
and the Archangael Michael as one and the same. Why should there be any issues?
Originally posted by robbie carrobiethere are 7 archangels who minister to god, as far as we know for sure jesus was not one of them, jesus never said he was and never mentions them. and the quote is the lord not as some call him by a name. the 4 letters which is given as gods name is made to sound easy to say [ humans use this], but a angel high or low would not.
As you have proffered no alternative can i assume that you dont know who the archangel is?
Originally posted by stokerevidence please.
there are 7 archangels who minister to god, as far as we know for sure jesus was not one of them, jesus never said he was and never mentions them. and the quote is the lord not as some call him by a name. the 4 letters which is given as gods name is made to sound easy to say [ humans use this], but a angel high or low would not.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI was first correcting the fact that you stuck "Jehovah" in the New Testament
what has this got to do with Michael the archangel? As far as i can discern, you have
made two attempts at this post, with no relevance to the subject at hand in either of
them. If you want to start your own threads on different subjects please do so, but this
is about Michael the archangel.
when the word is "Lord" and that refers to Christ. He is Lord of Lords, and
King of Kings. It will be seen later how this has a bearing on who Michael
the Archangel is or is not.