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236d
@moonbus saidI don't think all Christians believe that. Receiving the holy spirit is to,
The doctrine is that the Holy Spirit is working those effects in mankind's faulty soul, not the man himself who has improved through his own effort. The man himself is only a corrupt vessel for the Holy Spirit to enter, and man's only choice is to let the Holy Spirit enter or to close himself off.
"put off your old self, which belongs to your former manner of life and is corrupt through deceitful desires, and to be renewed in the spirit of your minds, and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness." (Ephesians 4:22-24)
Again, surely this results in a Christian becoming a better person? How could it not? - It speaks of not only being renewed in the spirit of the mind (soul) but of putting on a new self mirroring God's righteousness. - Would such a transformed person continue to steal their bosses sandwich from the office fridge?
236d
@ghost-of-a-duke saidOne might still be tempted to, and that is what KJ keeps reminding us of when he says we are all evil at heart.
I don't think all Christians believe that. Receiving the holy spirit is to,
"put off your old self, which belongs to your former manner of life and is corrupt through deceitful desires, and to be renewed in the spirit of your minds, and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness." (Ephesians 4:22-24)
Again, sure ...[text shortened]... s. - Would such a transformed person continue to steal their bosses sandwich from the office fridge?
But in principle I do agree with you that people can change for the better.
235d
@medullah saidMatthew 3:10
Thanks for your observations, but in truth they don’t prove a Hell.
To burn somebody for all eternity is cruel. But the Scripture in Romans telling us that the wages of sin are death puts this to bed for me.
We can though agree to disagree like gentlemen, and put this to the side for another day?
Even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees. Every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
John 15:6
If anyone does not abide in me he is thrown away like a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned.
Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire.
Revelation 20:14
Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
You may call it cruel, but I don't think we see our sins as God does, neither do we see the righteousness of God that all of our crimes against deity are done against, we may disagree but the truth of it remains no matter how we dislike it. There are many things we call cruel in this life, they happen anyway, our notions about those things we like and dislike do not alter reality.
234d
@moonbus saidDo you think God, will, and can over look sin and not deal with it?
One might still be tempted to, and that is what KJ keeps reminding us of when he says we are all evil at heart.
But in principle I do agree with you that people can change for the better.
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234d
@kellyjay saidIs such a thing beyond God's ability?
Do you think God, will, and can over look sin and not deal with it?
234d
@fmf saidThat is a moot point which I’m sure wasn’t your intent, but we get into many a true word is spoke in jest.
Are there some translations that are more divinely inspired than others?
One might argue that those with the less accurate renditions are less inspired ?
234d
@kellyjay saidWhere did all this justified stuff come from ?
No, we are sinners saved by grace, being justified is one thing walking with the Lord is quite the other. We are to pick up our crosses and follow Christ, we are to repent, we are to confess our sins to the Lord so we can be forgiven. Justified is not having our crimes laid at our feet, but put on Jesus's cross abiding in Christ our nature is now changed, we have power over ...[text shortened]... Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.
What is the rationale for its introduction ?
234d
@ghost-of-a-duke saidGod being good and just would have to accept evil and in doing that become corrupt which would run counter to His nature.
Is such a thing beyond God's ability?