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  1. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    25 Oct '11 00:32
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-24/libya-will-be-a-moderate-muslim-nation-after-qaddafi-ntc-chairman-says.html

  2. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    25 Oct '11 14:35
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-24/libya-will-be-a-moderate-muslim-nation-after-qaddafi-ntc-chairman-says.html

    Well we were happy for them to embrace a democracy, weren't we?
  3. 25 Oct '11 18:11
    Well, they are a Muslim country. But I worry about the Coptic Christians.
  4. 25 Oct '11 19:45
    Originally posted by Kunsoo
    Well, they are a Muslim country. But I worry about the Coptic Christians.
    Libya is overwhelmingly Muslim, as far as Im aware the only country in the region with any significant Coptic Christian population is Egypt.

    Personally I feel that if the Libyan people, through democratic mechanisms, freely opt for a Muslim system of law I see no good reason why this should be met with opposition or hostility.
  5. 25 Oct '11 20:22
    Originally posted by generalissimo
    Personally I feel that if the Libyan people, through democratic mechanisms, freely opt for a Muslim system of law I see no good reason why this should be met with opposition or hostility.
    Democracy should never decide certain things including some of the major aspects of law. Democracy supposedly benefits the majority and can cause minorities to suffer.
    Anything that is partial to one subset of people should not be decided by democracy because it amounts to one group imposing their will on another. That is why secularism is important.
    The other major flaw in any religious law, is that it gets manipulated via the religions figureheads who are not elected democratically nor may be suitable people to be making such decisions yet people are reluctant to criticise because it is seen as criticising the religion.
  6. 25 Oct '11 20:39
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Democracy should never decide certain things including some of the major aspects of law. Democracy supposedly benefits the majority and can cause minorities to suffer.
    Anything that is partial to one subset of people should not be decided by democracy because it amounts to one group imposing their will on another. That is why secularism is important.
    Th ...[text shortened]... decisions yet people are reluctant to criticise because it is seen as criticising the religion.
    Of course, the alternative to the majority deciding the law is a minority deciding the law. Is there a third option?
  7. 25 Oct '11 20:42
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Democracy should never decide certain things including some of the major aspects of law. Democracy supposedly benefits the majority and can cause minorities to suffer.
    Anything that is partial to one subset of people should not be decided by democracy because it amounts to one group imposing their will on another. That is why secularism is important.
    Th ...[text shortened]... decisions yet people are reluctant to criticise because it is seen as criticising the religion.
    Shariah law, and theocratic systems of government in general are not at all congenial to my tastes.

    My point is simply that I don't think a particular model of government should be forcibly imposed on the Libyan people, if they freely choose to have shariah law that is their choice and the international community has no right whatsoever to intervene.

    This is not in my opinion a discussion on the merits of secularism or any alternatives to secular government, this is a question of Libya's national sovereignty and the right of its people to choose their system of government.
  8. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    25 Oct '11 20:49
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Democracy should never decide certain things including some of the major aspects of law. Democracy supposedly benefits the majority and can cause minorities to suffer.
    Anything that is partial to one subset of people should not be decided by democracy because it amounts to one group imposing their will on another. That is why secularism is important.
    Th ...[text shortened]... decisions yet people are reluctant to criticise because it is seen as criticising the religion.
    Perhaps it would be best to see what laws they actually pass. The ones mentioned in the article regarding interest, marriage and divorce are well within the sphere of legitimate governmental power. We'll have to see if the actual statutes violate Natural Rights though it's fairly certain some of them will (as many in the West do).
  9. 25 Oct '11 20:55
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Perhaps it would be best to see what laws they actually pass. The ones mentioned in the article regarding interest, marriage and divorce are well within the sphere of legitimate governmental power. We'll have to see if the actual statutes violate Natural Rights though it's fairly certain some of them will (as many in the West do).
    We'll have to see if the actual statutes violate Natural Rights...

  10. 25 Oct '11 21:34
    Originally posted by generalissimo
    [b]We'll have to see if the actual statutes violate Natural Rights...

    [/b]
    I see no violations if one allows for the Natural Rights of Honor Killings and the Natural Right of husbands to abuse their families.
  11. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    25 Oct '11 21:36
    Originally posted by Eladar
    I see no violations if one allows for the Natural Rights of Honor Killings and the Natural Right of husbands to abuse their families.
    Is it your contention that all Muslim countries allow such things under their understanding of Sharia Law? if so, you are displaying ignorance.
  12. 25 Oct '11 21:41
    Originally posted by kmax87
    Well we were happy for them to embrace a democracy, weren't we?
    It's worth pointing out that Gaddafi's dictatorship also operated according to an interpretation of Islamic law, albeit a highly eccentric one.
  13. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    25 Oct '11 21:45 / 1 edit
    Perhaps this article may enlighten:

    CAIRO — Libya’s new leaders said they intend to make Islamic Sharia law the main source of legislation and will nullify any laws that contradict its tenets, giving the country a more Islamist character in the post-Moammar Gadhafi era.

    Islamic law, or Sharia, is enshrined as the basis of the constitution in a number of Middle Eastern countries with Muslim majorities. Most Gulf nations’ constitutions state that Sharia is a main source of legislation, while Egypt says it is “the source.”

    Using Sharia as the basis for legislation will place Libya alongside Arab nations such as Egypt and Iraq that ensure that no laws contradict the tenets of Islam, but don’t necessarily implement all provisions of Sharia. Egyptian laws remain largely secular as Sharia does not cover all aspects of modern life.

    However Libya is not headed down the same path as Saudi Arabia and Iran, which follow a stricter interpretation of Sharia — cutting off the hands of thieves, the heads of murderers and stoning adulterers to death. Those who drink alcohol are publicly flogged.

    The role of Sharia law in Muslim society varies according to interpretations that often depend on political landscape, cultural norms, religious makeup.

    Libya’s transitional leader Mustafa Abdul-Jalil, speaking at a ceremony Sunday night to declare the country liberated from Gadhafi, said he intends to legalize polygamy, restricted under Gadhafi.

    The one area where Islamic law is nearly universal is in personal status law — rules concerning marriage, divorce and inheritance. Sharia allows men to marry up to four women, without the approval of one another even without their knowledge. Men are also allowed to divorce their wives by proclamation.

    Women have the right to ask for a divorce under any circumstances, without the man’s approval, but in such a case the woman foregoes rights to alimony. Islamic law also stipulates that married daughters receive half the inheritance that sons receive and insists that women have the right to a dowry upon marriage.

    Abdul-Jalil singled out banks charging interest as something that will be abolished in Libya to conform with Sharia laws that equate bank interest with usury.

    Islamic banks around the world avoid charging interest on deposits but aim to reward investors in other ways. Islamic banks do not lend money to businesses engaged in activities that are considered immoral, such as casinos and distilleries.

    Sharia gives guidelines for Islamic values that are based on the teachings of the Quran and Sunna, a compilation of the sayings and deeds of the Prophet Muhammad.

    It does not necessarily mean the imposition of harsh punishments.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle-east/libyas-new-leaders-say-they-will-make-islamic-sharia-law-main-source-of-legislation/2011/10/24/gIQAyE6PDM_story.html
  14. 26 Oct '11 14:28
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-24/libya-will-be-a-moderate-muslim-nation-after-qaddafi-ntc-chairman-says.html

    How many other countries can Obama push io Sharia law do you think?
  15. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    26 Oct '11 15:11
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-24/libya-will-be-a-moderate-muslim-nation-after-qaddafi-ntc-chairman-says.html

    surely you're not surprised!