Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. SubscriberTom Wolsey
    Aficionado of Prawns
    Texas
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    12 Jun '18 15:43
    Originally posted by @wolfe63
    "I expect the lying racist troll Tom Wolsey, of course, to admire and completely support that."

    This was a direct Duchess64 response to a post by TW. Her detached style comes off like the serial killer from "Silence of the Lambs".

    "It rubs the lotion lotion on it's skin."

    The chick is flat-out weird.
    Maybe they are terms of endearment. It's starting to grow on me!
  2. Standard membershavixmir
    Guppy poo
    Sewers of Holland
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    12 Jun '18 17:57
    Originally posted by @mchill
    America is a wonderful country in many ways, as a business owner, I'm thankful to live in a place where free market enterprises are encouraged. American's however, are hurting themselves in many ways in thinking if you don't finish # 1, you've failed. This stands in stark contrast to thinking in other parts of the world.

    In a former NY Times bestseller a ...[text shortened]... icle on this very subject.

    https://hbr.org/2012/08/our-unhealthy-obsession-with-winning.html
    Winning is a goal. And the goal is nothing more than one of many mortivations.

    What’s important is enjoying participating.

    Like writing a book. If you’re only writing to try to get published, you’re wasting your time. If you’re writing because it gives you great pleasure, you’re busy enjoying yourself.

    And that’s what life is about.
  3. Standard memberSleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    Dustbin of history
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    12 Jun '18 18:001 edit
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    And that’s what life is about.
    The Zen teachings of Shavixmir.
  4. Standard membershavixmir
    Guppy poo
    Sewers of Holland
    Joined
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    12 Jun '18 18:37
    Originally posted by @sleepyguy
    The Zen teachings of Shavixmir.
    Yeah man, I’m a bloody hippie.
  5. Joined
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    8851
    13 Jun '18 08:571 edit
    Originally posted by @wolfe63
    Complete rubbish. Nice try at re-writing American history. Your understanding of the facts and the motives behind the war are poorly constructed suppositions.

    I would suggest that you read just one of Sir Winston Churchill's six volumes on "the Second World War" published in 1951.

    But...I realize any facts that contradict your comfortable rationalizations will be thoughtlessly rejected.
    Wolfe63 prefers to deny that the uncomfortable reality was that American society was still very much anti joining the war until Pearl Harbour, and even then, it was far more focussed on destroying Japan and most Americans had the attitude "we'll fight in the Pacific and let the Europeans do their thing". If Germany and Italy had not declared war on America, it's unlikely FDR would have had the breathing room to join the European theatre(by this point FDR wanted to join the Allies.) American public opinion didn't allow for it. Wolfe63 is becoming far too defensive when confronted with historical realities. America was very reluctant to join the allied powers.

    The other allied powers are grateful that America contributed to the war, but stop short of historical revisionism to make it seem as though they were always part of it. American stalling to join the European theatre cost an unknown number of lives. America certainly can't take all the credit for defeating Nazism.
  6. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 00:29
    Originally posted by @ashiitaka to Wolfe63
    Wolfe63 prefers to deny that the uncomfortable reality was that American society was still very much anti joining the war until Pearl Harbour, and even then, it was far more focussed on destroying Japan and most Americans had the attitude "we'll fight in the Pacific and let the Europeans do their thing". If Germany and Italy had not declared wa ...[text shortened]... st an unknown number of lives. America certainly can't take all the credit for defeating Nazism.
    Ash, although I could take issue with you on some points, what you have written about the
    Second World War seems broadly correct. As a jingoistic American, Wolfe63 seems too
    'brainwashed' by 'the USA saved the rest of the world in both world wars" narratives.

    FDR had been moving the USA closer toward war on the Allied side, but Japan's surprise
    attack on Pearl Harbor was what was needed to push the USA over the edge into open war.

    An American professor of English (not history) has written a popular book about the First World War
    in which he argues that the USA won the First World War practically single-handedly.
    This book received mostly favorable reviews from American journalists and was
    denounced as rubbish by British academic historians.
  7. Seongnam, S. Korea
    Joined
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    20331
    14 Jun '18 01:50
    Originally posted by @mchill
    America is a wonderful country in many ways, as a business owner, I'm thankful to live in a place where free market enterprises are encouraged. American's however, are hurting themselves in many ways in thinking if you don't finish # 1, you've failed. This stands in stark contrast to thinking in other parts of the world.

    In a former NY Times bestseller a ...[text shortened]... icle on this very subject.

    https://hbr.org/2012/08/our-unhealthy-obsession-with-winning.html
    Geez, I don't know. If you could actually be the best tennis player in the world but decide not to, that sounds silly.

    I do not know why you would not take the chance to be an elite person in your field and to also get a paycheck from doing something that you love but... You'd rather just pursue a career as a doctor where you make less money, have zero recognition, and work 50-60+ hours a week...

    None of that make sense...

    BUT, let's say someone is an average chess player and has zero prospects of ever earning a dime from it, and they have a perfectly decent middle class job... Yeah, in these contexts striking the perfect life/work/hobby balance and not caring about winning is logical.

    WHy care so much about winning when you are just a regular guy on a website or in the office?

    ... But even still... Why not try to be the best that you can be?

    IDK.

    This whole thing is like trying to validate platitudes with an example that does a bad job of it.
  8. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 02:021 edit
    Originally posted by @philokalia to Mchill
    Geez, I don't know. If you could actually be the best tennis player in the world but decide not to, that sounds silly.

    I do not know why you would not take the chance to be an elite person in your field and to also get a paycheck from doing something that you love but... You'd rather just pursue a career as a doctor where you make less mone ...[text shortened]... his whole thing is like trying to validate platitudes with an example that does a bad job of it.
    People should be less judgmental (than Mchll and others) about what's 'healthy' or not.

    If one hopes to become a concert pianist, one needs, in addition to talent, an obsession with practice.
    That's practice, not 'winning'. All the top professional musicians have practiced intensively since an early age.
    There's a fairly direct correlation between the amount of practice and one's professional success.
    Mediocre musicians tend to have practiced significantly less than the top musicians.

    Is having a child practice playing the piano for many hours almost every day 'healthy'?
    It depends. Many, if not most, children could not endure it. But some children are willing
    to make that sacrifice in the hope of a future reward.
  9. Behind the scenes
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 02:08
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    People should be less judgmental (than Mchlll) about what's 'healthy' or not.

    If one hopes to become a concert pianist, one needs, in addition to talent, an obsession with practice.
    That's practice, not 'winning'. All the top professional musicians have practiced intensively since an early age.
    There's a fairly direct correlation between the amount ...[text shortened]... ndure it. But some children are willing
    to make that sacrifice in the hope of a future reward.
    Duchess - At the risk of being labeled a racist, sexist troll with abysmal reading comprehension for the 50th time, I would like you to consider that Harvard Business School, an institution full of over producers, thinks this as well. I would invite you to re read their article. 🙂

    https://hbr.org/2012/08/our-unhealthy-obsession-with-winning.html
  10. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 02:232 edits
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Duchess - At the risk of being labeled a racist, sexist troll with abysmal reading comprehension for the 50th time, I would like you to consider that Harvard Business School, an institution full of over producers, thinks this as well. I would invite you to re read their article. 🙂

    https://hbr.org/2012/08/our-unhealthy-obsession-with-winning.html
    I never wrote that Mchill's ALONE in thinking this. I mentioned Mchill mainly because
    Philokalia's post (which Mchill has ignored) seemed directed at Mchill personally.

    It's a judgment call about what's 'unhealthy' in an obsession.
    When I was learning English, I may have had what some people would call an 'obsession'
    because I looked up every unfamiliar word in a dictionary and spent many hours practicing
    my pronunciation. Some people would sneer, of course, at the amount of work that I did.
    But I did not have the priceless advantage of being born as a white native speaker, with
    my English already naturally as good as Donald Trump's (sarcasm intended).
  11. Behind the scenes
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 02:42
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    I never wrote that Mchill's ALONE in thinking this. I mentioned Mchill mainly because
    Philokalia's post (which Mchill has ignored) seemed directed at Mchill personally.

    It's a judgment call about what's 'unhealthy' in an obsession.
    When I was learning English, I may have had what some people would call an 'obsession'
    because I looked up every unfam ...[text shortened]... native speaker, with
    my English already naturally as good as Donald Trump's (sarcasm intended).
    If you were trying to defend my argument I appreciate your effort, but I frequently find Philokalia's logic a bit hazy, and frequently don't respond his posts. Please don't make the mistake of thinking I don't read them however, because I do.

    Yes, It is a judgment call about what's 'unhealthy' in an obsession, but I was trying to point out a balanced approach to our efforts is sometimes a healthier approach.
  12. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 04:24
    Originally posted by @mchill
    If you were trying to defend my argument I appreciate your effort, but I frequently find Philokalia's logic a bit hazy, and frequently don't respond his posts. Please don't make the mistake of thinking I don't read them however, because I do.

    Yes, It is a judgment call about what's 'unhealthy' in an obsession, but I was trying to point out a balanced approach to our efforts is sometimes a healthier approach.
    Smyslov considered leaving chess to become a professional opera singer.
    In chess, he became a world champion. As an opera singer, he
    probably could have become no better than an average professional.
    Yet which choice would have made him happier?
  13. Behind the scenes
    Joined
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    14 Jun '18 06:54
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    Smyslov considered leaving chess to become a professional opera singer.
    In chess, he became a world champion. As an opera singer, he
    probably could have become no better than an average professional.
    Yet which choice would have made him happier?
    Yet which choice would have made him happier?


    Only Smyslov would know for sure.
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