paul on the road to damacus

The Apostle Paul speaks too, too much about the living Jesus Christ. He speaks especially about the living Jesus Christ from His resurrection.

And this should be expected. Jesus said it was EXPEDIENT for His lovers and disciples that He go away in death and come again in resurrection.

"But I tell you the truth, It is expedient for you that I go away ; for if I do not go away the Comforter will not come to you, but if I go, I will send Him to you."

Okay then. When and where did Jesus send this Comforter to the disciples ? He sent Him into the disciples by breathing into the disciples on the evening of the day He rose from the dead.

Right here.

"When therefore it was evening on the day, the first day of the week, and while the doors were shut where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and said to them,

Peace be with you." (20:19)

He COMFORTED them once as they were USE to being COMFORTED before, seeing His visible physical presence.

"And when He has said this , He showed them His hands and His side. The disciples therefore rejoiced at seeing the Lord. (v.20)

NOW, praise God. He comforts them AGAIN according to the more expedient situation. He comforts them by coming into them as the Holy breath - the Holy Spirit.

"Then Jesus said to them again, Peace be to you; as the Father has sent Me, I also send you.

And when He had said this, He breathed into them and said to them,

Receive the Holy Spirit." (vs. 21,22)

Right there! He breathed HIMSELF into them to be the inward, indwelling, dispensed Holy Spirit, the another Comforter.

Did I ever mention that Paul said Christ in resurrection became a life giving Spirit ?

"the last Adam became a life giving Spirit." (1 Cor. 15:45)

Originally posted by @thinkofone
The great theologian Soren Kierkegaard, writing in The Journals:
"In the teachings of Christ, religion is completely present tense: Jesus is the prototype and our task is to imitate him, become a disciple. But then through Paul came a basic alteration. Paul draws attention away from imitating Christ and fixes attention on the death of Christ The Atoner ...[text shortened]... turning it upside down. making it just the opposite of the original proclamation of Christ"[/b]

Are you going to throw out all the writings of Luke, Peter, and anything Jesus said, because
according to scripture they all supported Paul, and you got this guy Kierkegaard.

Now some dear evangelical friends may get nervous at my using First Corinthians 15:45 that the last Adam became a life giving Spirit.

"Do you mean the Holy Spirit is not co-eternal?"

Of course the THIRD of the Triune God - the Spirit is the ETERNAL SPIRIT (Hebrews 9:14)

Nevertheless we should take everything the Bible says,
The Spirit is eternal. AND ...

"the last Adam [Christ] became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45b)

Something NEW happened in the evening of Christ's resurrection. Christ breathed into the disciples the eternal Spirit who had now PICKED up the incarnated and resurrected God-man Jesus.

He was the second Comforter.
Or He is the First Comforter come in another form - as comforting indwelling divine life giving Spirit.

Jesus Christ can live in us. Jesus Christ can bring the eternal God into us.

It is rather mysterious.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
Are you going to throw out all the writings of Luke, Peter, and anything Jesus said, because
according to scripture they all supported Paul, and you got this guy Kierkegaard.

How exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Really think about it KJ!

You come up with some of the most inane comments ever posted on this forum and that's saying something. I shudder to think what you do for a living.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
How exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Really think about it KJ!

You come up with some of the most inane comments ever posted on this forum and that's saying something. I shudder to think what you do for a living.

Yet Jesus spoke for Paul, so did Luke and Peter are you going to respond about all three
of them or pretend you didn't see the other names too?

Originally posted by @thinkofone
How exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Really think about it KJ!

You come up with some of the most inane comments ever posted on this forum and that's saying something. I shudder to think what you do for a living.

The Jesus you preach doesn't have the full backing of all scripture so he isn't the same
one I worship.

Originally posted by @whodey
I've already done research on the matter. From what I've learned, Constantine adopted the new fledgling religion as his own only to conquer with it. He was not even a Christian, although it was rumored that he converted on his death bed. Soon afterwards, the Catholic church that was subsequently created was credited with all sorts of evils, like the Inqui ...[text shortened]... ith contempt due to their war like nature and corruption, virtually condemning them all to hell.

You might find "Creating Christ: How Roman Emperors Invented Christianity" by James Valliant, C.W. Fahy interesting. The stuff you are talking about has got nothing to do with what the book is about. The book is about Paul. Constantine lived about 250 years later.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
The Jesus you preach doesn't have the full backing of all scripture so he isn't the same
one I worship.

But how exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Can you really not understand that your response doesn't at all address the question?

Originally posted by @kellyjay
Yet Jesus spoke for Paul, so did Luke and Peter are you going to respond about all three
of them or pretend you didn't see the other names too?

Sorry. Just noticed this other response.

If you believe that Jesus spoke for Paul in the gospel preached by Him during His ministry, by all means post all the passages.

And the question still stands: But how exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

Originally posted by @fmf
You might find "Creating Christ: How Roman Emperors Invented Christianity" by James Valliant, C.W. Fahy interesting. The stuff you are talking about has got nothing to do with what the book is about. The book is about Paul. Constantine lived about 250 years later.

And the church was largely blameless until Constantine subverted the faith, for some 250 years. People met in private homes as mostly women ran the services, that is, those not thrown to the lions.

Naturally, people. will still trash the early church despite this fact.

i don't think paul heard or saw jesus on the road to damascus.

i think he had an epileptic fit. an epileptic fit can cause both temporary blindness and hearing voices.

paul saw a bright light, went blind for three days and heard voices. anything else added to the story i believe is exageration.

So you think Paul used this epileptic fit to go out of his way to suffer for the rest of his life, ending in beheading?

"Ministers of Christ are they? I speak as being beside myself,

I more so! In labors more abundantly, in imprisonments more abundantly, in stripes excessively, in deaths often,

Under the hands of the Jews five times I received forty stripes less one;

Three times I was beaten with rods, once I was stoned, three times I was shipwrecked, a night and a day I have spent in the deep.

In journeys often, in dangers of rivers, in dangers of robbers, in dangers from my race, in dangers from the Gentiles, in dangers in the city, in dangers in the wilderness, in dangers in the sea, in dangers among false brothers;

In labor and hardship; in watchings often; in hunger and thirst; in fastings often; in cold and nakedness -

Apart from the things which have not been mentioned, there is this: the crowd of cares pressing upon me daily, the anxious concern for all the churches.

Who is weak, and I am not weak?
Who is stumbled, and I myself do not burn?"
( See Second Corinthians 11:23-29)

I don't think Paul underwent these things because of misinterpreting an epileptic seizure.

He persecuted those who called on the name of Jesus. And Jesus told Ananias that He Himself would show this young man what he would have to go through for the sake of the name of Jesus.

" And here he has authority from the chief priests to bind all who call upon Your name.

But the Lord said to him [Ananias], Go, for this man is a chosen vessel to Me, to bear My name before both the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel,

For I will show him how many things he must suffer on behalf of My name." ( Acts 9:15,16)

Originally posted by @whodey
And the church was largely blameless until Constantine subverted the faith, for some 250 years. People met in private homes as mostly women ran the services, that is, those not thrown to the lions.

Naturally, people. will still trash the early church despite this fact.

The book "Creating Christ: How Roman Emperors Invented Christianity" by James Valliant, C.W. Fahy is about something else. If what you are talking about - Constantine - were now i.e. 2018, then the book would be about stuff that happened in the mid-18th century, that's around 1750.

If you're not interested, then fine. The book isn't about Constantine. The book is about Paul.

The book - which you obviously haven't read - doesn't set out to "trash the early church"; it examines Paul's role in its inception. If you want to listen to an mp3 of the introduction (1 hour) and the conclusion (1 hour) before deciding whether to listen to the detailed scriptural and historical evidence (approx 10 hours) then PM me and I'll send you the files.

You referring to Constantine repeatedly points to a gap in your knowledge. Indeed, you don't seem to even understand which century we are talking about.

As I say, you may not agree with the book's analysis, but it's well and truly a study of the Bible itself and the historical context, so I am sure you would find it fascinating.

Originally posted by @whodey
Naturally, people. will still trash the early church despite this fact.

In 398 pages, the book does not even once express any doubt or scepticism about Jesus being the 'Messiah' or sent by God or being the 'Son of God'. The book does not "trash" the beliefs of the huge numbers of people who converted to or became followers of Christ. That isn't what the book is about. The book is about Paul.

Originally posted by @fmf
In 398 pages, the book does not even once express any doubt or scepticism about Jesus being the 'Messiah' or sent by God or being the 'Son of God'. The book does not "trash" the beliefs of the huge numbers of people who converted to or became followers of Christ. That isn't what the book is about. The book is about Paul.

I see, so trashing Paul who wrote the majority of the NT.

I bet Raj would do it for free. No need to sell any books.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Sorry. Just noticed this other response.

If you believe that Jesus spoke for Paul in the gospel preached by Him during His ministry, by all means post all the passages.

And the question still stands: But how exactly does it make LOGICAL sense that I'd throw out everything that Jesus said when I've been a longtime advocate for the gospel preached by Jesus during His ministry?

The gospel is the good news, its about Jesus who Paul talked about as well as Luke and
Peter.

You have so far still refused to address those writers of text Peter and Luke! They both
back Paul and his teaching what do you do with them?

If you take Jesus' words in scripture, all of Jesus' words in scripture, than Jesus calling
Paul into the ministry and assigning him the task of preaching, you must reject them if
you reject what Jesus did with Paul.

Luke wrote one of the gospels do you doubt that whole book because Luke also wrote
Acts which highlights Paul getting saved and sharing the gospel?

Then there is Peter who had a real close relationship with Jesus as one of the 12, you
going to throw out Peter's books because of what he said about Paul's letters?

2 Peter 3:
15 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, 16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.