- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
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09 Oct 13
8 edits
First remove the plank from your own doctrine and then maybe you can see the speck in mine.
You are doing your best to "remove the plank" from my own doctrine everytime you refer to jaywill / sonship in the sarcastic way you do.
Face it Rajk999 - YOU ATTACK. Let's face it. You go on the offensive.
I am willing to forgive you. And I am willing to start out by examining the weaknesses of mainstream reform theology.
But since you seem to get real busy chopping away at the planks yourself I have to make sure you don't over chop.
A simple and fundamental thing like the Sermon on the Mount you see fit to claim that Christ meant that for disciples [12 people] only. Your entire view of eternal life and justification and grace is all screwed up. The reason is simple. You do not preach the basis of Christ teachings of love and charity.
Yea, I hear you ASSERT that. What I do NOT hear you do is a detailed examination of exactly WHERE the problem is.
Now sometime you put up a one liner. And I respond with a long detailed response, which I doubt that you even READ.
But as long as you do not SHOW me where the error is I am not going to think you are able to do so.
You preach mouth worship first.
ONE of the things I preach is what the Apostle Paul preached. And that is Romans 10:9.
Unlike you, that is not the ONLY thing I write about. But when I DO write about it, you attack it. And your attack is not on me it is on the New Testament at Romans 10:9.
Now you may have countered with Matthew 7:21-23 which mind you I encouraged readers to bring it up. I took the initiative to suggest that someone should bring up the passage where some who called Lord, Lord are told to depart from the Lord.
My explanation was that this is the loss of REWARD.
It is NOT the loss of eternal salvation.
I stand by that still. I am opened, genuinely opened to any argument that it HAS to be the loss of eternal life. But you are going to have rough time.
That is because there is a distinction between the GIFT and the REWARD/s related to the millennial kingdom.
Salvation comes next [salvation which God himself cannot revoke]
Then if someone desires then maybe they can love God and love others [ if they feel like it]
You ASSUME that because I teach that we can call Lord Jesus and believe in the heart only to be saved, that I encourage what we use to call "Cheap Grace".
You see Rajk999, I am kind of an old warrior. I have been aware of these contraversies for a long time. You spoke of being saved in the early 70s. Me too. We have both been in the Scripture for decades.
"Cheap grace" is the term some use to use for being saved and then going out and living the same old sinful life. How do you deal with such a problem?
YOUR way to deal with it is to teach that the believer can lose the eternal life and the eternal redemption.
I think MY way to deal with it is far more biblical and accurate. It is to be disciplined by losing the REWARD concerning the millennial kingdom.
I DO NOT SEE effective rebuttals of my explanations from you. I simply do not see impressive rebuttals. Occasionally, I see a good passage you put up which needs to be dealt with. And I do it.
If there is a passage that I have NOT addressed yet, and you want to hear me speak to it, then put it out there. But I doubt that you really READ my replies carefully.
Now to end this post something of a caveat -
SOMETIMES the New Testament uses SALVATION or SAVED in a sense of entering into maturity of kingdom living. Those passages could be misunderstood by some as eternal justification through doing good works.
I am certain that that would be a misunderstanding. But you are right that God is not satisfied simply in FORGIVING sinners. And I have never, never, ever taught that.
That has to be the most screwed up doctrine on the planet. Even Hindus and Buddhists preach more about Jesus Christ than you do.
This thread is not mainly for you Rajk999. It is still for Refuting Rajk999's junky attempt to go back to the Law keeping of the Old Testament to earn eternal life which is "the GIFT OF GOD" .
- Joined
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09 Oct 13
1 edit
Some of you may remember that I wrote a thread a few months back on the Gehenna of fire, or somethling like that.
The thread is probably still on some distant page of the Forum.
For the record - THAT THREAD on the Gehenna of fire was designed especially to prove that God could punish a Christian temporarily. That is a Christian who has eternal life.
That thread was designed to prove that just because I believe in Justification by Faith or believing in the heart and confessing with the mouth that all fear of the Father's discipline of His children (saved forever) is removed. To remove all fear of discipline from the Father who has saved you forever is unwise according to the New Testament.
[Edited]
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYou do whatever it is you see is needed as someone who cares about
so i asked you what you do, you fobbed us off with an insipid platitude and we are still unaware what it is you do to DEMONSTRATE this alleged love that you have for God and people, why dont you answer and tell us? Is it a secret?
another would do. You don't have people in your life that you care about,
and with them you don't do whatever it is they need? Seriously, if you
care about them so you just visit them with the your Bible in your hand
when they need food, cloths, and shelter, go back and read the post you
replied to, I SAID meet their needs. You claiming that is me "fobbed us
off with an insipid platitude" is very insulting.
Kelly
09 Oct 13
Originally posted by KellyJayyou still haven't told us how you demonstrate love to God and your neighbour.
You do whatever it is you see is needed as someone who cares about
another would do. You don't have people in your life that you care about,
and with them you don't do whatever it is they need? Seriously, if you
care about them so you just visit them with the your Bible in your hand
when they need food, cloths, and shelter, go back and read the post you ...[text shortened]... ds. You claiming that is me "fobbed us
off with an insipid platitude" is very insulting.
Kelly
09 Oct 13
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI'm not going to share that here, I don't like sharing good things I do least
you still haven't told us how you demonstrate love to God and your neighbour.
I brag about it. If you want to announce all the great things you do that
is your reward, mine is not dependent upon you.
Kelly
09 Oct 13
1 edit
Originally posted by KellyJayok modesty prevents you, I understand, I just wondered that all, maybe you did like voluntary work of some description. I apologise if I insulted you.
I'm not going to share that here, I don't like sharing good things I do least
I brag about it. If you want to announce all the great things you do that
is your reward, mine is not dependent upon you.
Kelly
10 Oct 13
Originally posted by robbie carrobieNot an insult or modesty, we are told to not do our good works before
ok modesty prevents you, I understand, I just wondered that all, maybe you did like voluntary work of some description. I apologise if I insulted you.
man, to not be like those that blow a horn so people can see the good
works they do. Ours are to be done in secret, between us and God.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayJesus also said that one does not light a light and sit it under a basket
Not an insult or modesty, we are told to not do our good works before
man, to not be like those that blow a horn so people can see the good
works they do. Ours are to be done in secret, between us and God.
Kelly
10 Oct 13
1 edit
Originally posted by KellyJaysure there is also something called false modesty and hiding ones light under a basket! saying that one does voluntary work or whatever is hardly blowing any horns.
There is a difference between leading a good life unashamed and blowing
one's horn on all the good things one does.
Kelly