Please turn on javascript in your browser to play chess.
Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    01 Sep '17 23:59 / 1 edit
    Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point, but too often little attention is given the progress that has been made. Take a look at the standard of living in the world 50, 100, or 200 years ago, and look at it now. Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared to what our ancestors faced, it's not so bad out there. I'm going to have a cup of tea, put on some background music and dissect my next chess opponent.

    P.S. Below is a link to the perfect background music for chess. This young lady is amazing!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1UrY_tRADk
  2. 02 Sep '17 00:05
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point, but too often little attention is given the progress that has been made. Take a look at the standard of living in the world 50, 100, or 200 years ago, and look at it now. Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared to what our ancestors fac ...[text shortened]... ound music for chess. This young lady is amazing!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1UrY_tRADk
    She plays guitar pretty well too!
  3. 02 Sep '17 00:08 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point, but too often little attention is given the progress that has been made. Take a look at the standard of living in the world 50, 100, or 200 years ago, and look at it now. Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared to what our ancestors fac ...[text shortened]... ound music for chess. This young lady is amazing!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O1UrY_tRADk
    "Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point ..."
    --Mchill

    As long it does not inconvenience privileged white men, of course. (sarcasm intended)

    "Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared
    to what our ancestors faced, it's not so bad out there."
    --Mchill

    100 years ago, did any people have to worry about being killed by nuclear weapons?
    100 years (or less) ago, it was easier to develop antibiotics that would be widely effective.
    Now it's becoming increasingly more difficult and costly to develop new antibiotics.

    Let's compare the record of genocides in the 20th century with that of the 19th century.
    Was there any improvement?

    My point is that people today have to face different problems (including nuclear weapons
    proliferation, climate change, running out of 'fossil fuel' energy sources) than they did 100 years ago.
    And there's no certainty that people today will be any better than our ancestors were at solving their problems.
  4. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    02 Sep '17 00:20
    Originally posted by @mchill
    Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point, but too often little attention is given the progress that has been made. Take a look at the standard of living in the world 50, 100, or 200 years ago, and look at it now. Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared to what our ancestors fac ...[text shortened]... ing to have a cup of tea, put on some background music and dissect my next chess opponent.
    You joined the site in June 2016 and have completed 11 games, playing 407 moves, of which 2 have been in this month.

    The high standard of living of which you seem so pleased is not shared across the planet nor even across the USA, which is the most unequal society in the developed world and which permits brutal levels of poverty and poor health without blushing.

    Our ancestors did not face the scale of threat represented by Trump's administration and the military resources it commands, in a nation whose constitution permits warmaking without sufficient awareness to even know how to locate the wars on a map, but seems to severely restrict social justice and place less and less value on the education systems required for an effective democracy.

    Nor have Americans ever been more at risk of arbitrary and unjust imprisonment, with only a 3% prospect of even being legally defended at a formal trial before being assigned for ridiculously long sentences to a private profit prison and compulsory work for the prison industries that are America's third largest employer.

    Nor did our ancestors face the imminent possibility of extinction as a species which now confronts us.

    This is not about nobility. It's about survival.
  5. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    02 Sep '17 00:25 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    "Calling attention to the injustices of the world can be a noble thing, up to a point ..."
    --Mchill

    As long it does not inconvenience privileged white men, of course. (sarcasm intended)

    "Yes, we face a multitude of problems, some minor and some major, but compared
    to what our ancestors faced, it's not so bad out there."
    --Mchill

    100 years a ...[text shortened]... ertainty that people today will be any better than our ancestors were at solving their problems.
    My point is that people today have to face different problems (including nuclear weapons
    proliferation, climate change, running out of 'fossil fuel' energy sources) than they did 100 years ago. And there's no certainty that people today will be any better than our ancestors were at solving their problems.

    This may be true, but it is also true that life expectancy has gone up, infant mortality has gone down, disease prevention has improved, as have standards of living in most nations. Economies and currencies are more stable, and those with mental and physical handicaps are generally treated more humanely than in decades past, just to name a few improvements. I didn't say everything is now a paradise on earth, but much progress has been made. I'm sorry you only see injustices, while ignoring everything else.
  6. 02 Sep '17 00:39
    Originally posted by @finnegan to Mchill
    You joined the site in June 2016 and have completed 11 games, playing 407 moves, of which 2 have been in this month.

    The high standard of living of which you seem so pleased is not shared across the planet nor even across the USA, which is the most unequal society in the developed world and which permits brutal levels of poverty and poor heal ...[text shortened]... nction as a species which now confronts us.

    This is not about nobility. It's about survival.
    "The high standard of living of which you seem so pleased is not shared across the planet nor even across the USA..."
    --Finnegan (to Mchill)

    Mchill always writes from the *unacknowledged* position of white male privilege in the USA.
  7. 02 Sep '17 00:49
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    "The high standard of living of which you seem so pleased is not shared across the planet nor even across the USA..."
    --Finnegan (to Mchill)

    Mchill always writes from the *unacknowledged* position of white male privilege in the USA.
    If he has a decently successful billing company, he is in the top 1 percent. He is making 6 figures, but Sh might be making more.

    Me, on the hand, I'm a shmuck making less than half than they bring down.

    But hey, we all die and no one takes it with him.
  8. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    02 Sep '17 02:06
    Originally posted by @eladar
    If he has a decently successful billing company, he is in the top 1 percent. He is making 6 figures, but Sh might be making more.

    Me, on the hand, I'm a shmuck making less than half than they bring down.

    But hey, we all die and no one takes it with him.
    And yet I'm betting that you agree with him that "life's not so bad out there", because you probably ate well today and you're totally unwilling to believe that even across America, there are children going to sleep hungry tonight. That's just not within your awareness, is it? Congratulations, you're a privileged white male, you simply don't have to be concerned about it. It's just "not your problem."
  9. 02 Sep '17 02:59
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    And yet I'm betting that you agree with him that "life's not so bad out there", because you probably ate well today and you're totally unwilling to believe that even across America, there are children going to sleep hungry tonight. That's just not within your awareness, is it? Congratulations, you're a privileged white male, you simply don't have to be concerned about it. It's just "not your problem."
    Life isn't so bad if you enjoy your job and have your family.
  10. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    02 Sep '17 04:27 / 5 edits
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    And yet I'm betting that you agree with him that "life's not so bad out there", because you probably ate well today and you're totally unwilling to believe that even across America, there are children going to sleep hungry tonight. That's just not within your awareness, is it? Congratulations, you're a privileged white male, you simply don't have to be concerned about it. It's just "not your problem."
    So many negative waves out there, try to keep things in perspective folks. Did people 4-5 generations ago live as well as us?? NO. That's all I was trying to get across, I didn't say things were a rose garden today. And "NO" I'm not a member of the 1%, I have a comfortable living, but it came at the expense of years of 6-7 day work weeks, and a lot of labor and stress (and my clients didn't care if I was a white male, they cared about results!) Are you listening Duchess and Suzianne? so please knock off the race baiting, it's getting old.

    Wow, I didn't think enjoying some good music and some good chess would bring out so much negativity here. Sorry about that!
  11. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    02 Sep '17 06:35
    in Europe the average living standard is much better than it was 200 years ago.
    Child death rates are way down, people grow a lot older, major diseases have been wiped out and the vast majority of people have warm homes, food and health care.

    Obviously there are groups within society (refugees, the unemployable, the uneducated) where things, in comparison, are not as good.

    It's still way better for them than 200 years ago: i.e. we don't have starving, disease ridden masses hanging around factory gates (the factories have been outsourced to the third world countries so the children there can work 16 hours a day).

    So, even the communities which are on the poorer end of the spectrum have better living standards than they did 200 years ago.

    This being said, Europe is now raising the first generation since 150 years ago, where the expectation is that the children won't be better off than the parents.
  12. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    02 Sep '17 09:17 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by @mchill
    So many negative waves out there, try to keep things in perspective folks. Did people 4-5 generations ago live as well as us?? NO. That's all I was trying to get across, I didn't say things were a rose garden today. And "NO" I'm not a member of the 1%, I have a comfortable living, but it came at the expense of years of 6-7 day work weeks, and a lot of labor ...[text shortened]... me good music and some good chess would bring out so much negativity here. Sorry about that!
    I suggest that the defect in your post is it seems inauthentic. It would be more convincing if you actually played much chess on this site but the record is clear- you don't. That doesn't make you a bad person - some very nice people play hardly any chess on this site and I know some quite decent humans who don't play chess at all. [I have a son who prefers World of Warcraft. :-( ]

    However, it is fair enough to draw attention to the self-harming element in political debates - they can drain away all positive energies and leave one depressed. A major source for this problem is that this forum is dominated by US contributors and they dominate the topics that can even be discussed. I mean to say, the USA only has 5% of the world's population, albeit with 25% of the world's prisoners and a majorty of the world's offensive weapons including nuclear missiles, so while that benighted land is totally depressing to contemplate there are a lot of alternative value systems in the remaining 95% of the planet, of which nationalist bigots deep in the North American continent choose to remain ignorant.

    Maybe the need is not primarily to count our complacent blessings as privileged members of the affluent First World, but simply to get grounded more often in reality outside of this malodorous cubicle. For some of us the priority may be to seek out more joyful material; for others it may be to address the bigotry and get in touch with social and political realities.

    “Bhikku Bodhi once explained mindfulness this way: The task of Right Mindfulness is to clear up the cognitive field. Mindfulness brings to light experience in its pure immediacy. It reveals the object as it is before it has been plastered over with conceptual paint, overlaid with interpretations. To practice mindfulness is thus a matter not so much of doing but of undoing, not thinking, not judging, not associating, not planning, not imagining, not wishing. “
  13. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    02 Sep '17 10:30
    Originally posted by @eladar
    Life isn't so bad if you enjoy your job and have your family.
    And what if you don't have a job, or a family, or even a place to stay for the night?

    What then? You don't even have a clue, do you?

    You don't even recognize that there are people in the world, hell, even in your own city, in precisely that position. And that's called white privilege.
  14. 02 Sep '17 11:25
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    And yet I'm betting that you agree with him that "life's not so bad out there", because you probably ate well today and you're totally unwilling to believe that even across America, there are children going to sleep hungry tonight. That's just not within your awareness, is it? Congratulations, you're a privileged white male, you simply don't have to be concerned about it. It's just "not your problem."
    Are you a privileged white female Suzy or can white men in America only be privileged?
  15. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    02 Sep '17 12:32
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Are you a privileged white female Suzy or can white men in America only be privileged?
    The difference here is that I AM concerned about it and yes, it IS my problem, and I spend a LOT of my free time on direct aid to the homeless in downtown Phoenix. And let me be clear. Most of these people are not white.

    Yes, I have privilege, due to my birth into a white, middle-class family in America. But I'm doing something about the plight of others less fortunate. Unlike others in my position, I cannot just turn my back on them or even spit on them as I step over them on the street, as I have seen other, even more "well-to-do" white people do. That's about the limit of interaction most whites have with these "street" people. And yeah, I see it every day.

    Thanks for asking.