Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Joined
    31 May '06
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    16 Apr '16 23:42
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    To boost people's confidence in the voting system.

    Also, issuing an ID to every citizen and registering their place of residence means that it will no longer be needed for citizens to register to vote - you simply send them a letter telling citizens they can vote for elections. This will make voting easier and less costly. There are numerous other benefits to this approach including making tax evasion more difficult.
    Really because in the UK we have a really cheep and efficient voting system that everyone trusts and is
    really reliable and we have neither ID cards nor any requirement to prove identity when voting.


    The thing is, ALL the problems with the voting system in the USA have NOTHING to do with in person
    identity fraud.
    There are a few tens of reported cases in the USA over the last... history of the USA.

    There is no voter ID fraud problem... So your big expensive and highly inaccurate national voter ID
    register will cost a whole bunch and solve precisely no existent problem.
    It WILL create a bunch of new problems due to the problems of keeping track of that many people
    especially the poor and those who move a lot to find work [and students].
    The records will be inaccurate, out of date, and have a whole big expensive bureaucracy around updating
    them.... For no purpose.

    On top of which, the people likely to be most inconvenienced, are those most likely to be democrats,
    and are those most likely to be the least enfranchised in society to kick off with, which on top of all the
    other problems makes this a partisan issue as well.
  2. Joined
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    16 Apr '16 23:44
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    No, only to some residents.

    http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/faq/voting-and-registration/who-is-eligible-to-vote-at-a-uk-general-election

    Interestingly it says nothing about residence. If the Irish all registered to vote in the UK, they could change the course of elections!
    That's the kind of thing that's possible in theory but in practice never actually happens.
  3. Standard memberbill718
    Enigma
    Seattle
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    17 Apr '16 09:413 edits
    Originally posted by whodey
    So you hate poor people just like the GOP?

    Of course, since blacks account for a large percentage of poor people then I guess this makes you a racist as well.

    Welcome to the dark side bill where everything you do, think, and say is wrong. 😵
    I am a moderate liberal Whodey. I believe the right wing has sometimes made it too difficult for the elderly and minorities to vote and I'm convinced this was done in a calculated and politically motivated way, witness those waiting 3-5 hours to vote in Arizona just a short time ago, no one is going to convince me that was an accident. States could devise plans to make sure each American citizen has proof of citizenship, and this would be easy to obtain, but many don't do it because they know many of the elderly and minorities tend to vote Democrat. While I agree (in principle) each citizen should have proof of citizenship in order to vote, I also agree this system will be manipulated by both sides in order to gain political advantage.

    The problem with you Whodey is you over simplify complicated issues, and it usually doesn't work that way.
  4. Germany
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    17 Apr '16 10:05
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    Really because in the UK we have a really cheep and efficient voting system that everyone trusts and is
    really reliable and we have neither ID cards nor any requirement to prove identity when voting.


    The thing is, ALL the problems with the voting system in the USA have NOTHING to do with in person
    identity fraud.
    There are a few tens of reporte ...[text shortened]... to kick off with, which on top of all the
    other problems makes this a partisan issue as well.
    The call from Republican politicians for voter ID's is obviously meant to discourage certain people to vote - no reasonable person would deny this.

    Nevertheless, a voter database (i.e. civil registry) and the consequent absence of a need for voters to register in fact makes it a lot easier to vote as long as the system is set up in a reasonably efficient manner. These systems exist in the Netherlands and in Finland - and I'm sure in many other places - and they are not "highly inaccurate" nor "expensive" and in fact allow for a streamlining of government bureaucracy that makes it much easier for citizens to deal with the government.
  5. SubscriberSuzianne
    Misfit Queen
    Isle of Misfit Toys
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    17 Apr '16 11:441 edit
    Originally posted by bill718
    I am a moderate liberal Whodey. I believe the right wing has sometimes made it too difficult for the elderly and minorities to vote and I'm convinced this was done in a calculated and politically motivated way, witness those waiting 3-5 hours to vote in Arizona just a short time ago, no one is going to convince me that was an accident. States could devise p ...[text shortened]... m with you Whodey is you over simplify complicated issues, and it usually doesn't work that way.
    I live in Arizona and I was totally unaffected by the smaller number of polling places this last primary election. Even though the number of polling places was cut roughly in half from preceding elections, I was able to vote easily and without waiting in any line.

    How, you ask? I am on the Permanent list to receive an early ballot in the mail. I filled out the ballot in my own spare time, and sent it back in the mail, about a week before the election. Easy-peasy. On election day, I sat back and laughed at all the morons who stood in line for hours on end just to be able to vote. Anyone who is a registered voter can also sign up to receive these early ballots just like I did. These people standing in line for hours are just like the idiots who get in their car and drive to the post office at 10pm on Tax Day to get in a long line to drop off their tax return by midnight. I've had my tax refund for a couple of months now because I filed electronically in February. Yeah, welcome to Arizona, home to conservatives and other morons.
  6. Joined
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    17 Apr '16 14:22
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    The call from Republican politicians for voter ID's is obviously meant to discourage certain people to vote - no reasonable person would deny this.

    Nevertheless, a voter database (i.e. civil registry) and the consequent absence of a need for voters to register in fact makes it a lot easier to vote as long as the system is set up in a reasonably effic ...[text shortened]... ng of government bureaucracy that makes it much easier for citizens to deal with the government.
    What you called for is a requirement for voter ID at polling stations.

    The ONLY problem this can possibly help solve is in person voter fraud.
    As I keep pointing out, that is a non-existent problem.

    Requiring ID at the polling stations slows down the process and increases costs and is
    therefore bad.

    Simply having a voter registry is not the same thing as having voter ID, and I suspect all
    countries that have voting have some such registry. Some managed more efficiently and
    accurately than others.

    But that is not what this thread is about.
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