Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Behind the scenes
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    02 Dec '18 16:511 edit
    I was 11 when I walked to our neighborhood theatre to see the very first James Bond film, and have been a Bond fan for decades, it hurts to have to admit this, but I feel this film series is now a cold war relic that has long since become irrelevant, and the concept of the super spy saving the world with his behind the scenes maneuvers, complete with hot women, violence, and lots of gadgets just doesn't work anymore. There are few things more sad than a film series that struggles to hang on to its former glory, long after it has become irrelevant. Daniel Craig at 50 is clearly too old to do the athletic stunts that today's demanding audiences require and the internal squabbling among the cast and crew has set production of the latest Bond production back another 1 - 2 years. I would have much preferred the Bond series had one last successful film and then retired.
    🙁

    https://www.theguardian.com/film/2018/aug/24/james-bond-film-delayed-until-2020-daniel-craig-danny-boyle
  2. Standard membervivify
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    02 Dec '18 17:272 edits
    @mchill said
    the concept of the super spy saving the world with his behind the scenes maneuvers, complete with hot women, violence, and lots of gadgets just doesn't work anymore.
    I disagree.

    The "Mission: Impossible" franchise, the Bourne franchise, the Taken series, the Jack Reacher series, the Alex Cross series....they're all pretty popular, especially Jack Reacher, based the books which are immensely popular and still top best-seller lists. The only reason Alex Cross isn't a popular movie series is due to the immensely bad casting choice for the lead character of the first (and probably only) film; but the books are well-liked.
  3. Joined
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    02 Dec '18 18:373 edits
    @mchill said
    I was 11 when I walked to our neighborhood theatre to see the very first James Bond film, and have been a Bond fan for decades, it hurts to have to admit this, but I feel this film series is now a cold war relic that has long since become irrelevant, and the concept of the super spy saving the world with his behind the scenes maneuvers, complete with hot women, violence, and l ...[text shortened]... s://www.theguardian.com/film/2018/aug/24/james-bond-film-delayed-until-2020-daniel-craig-danny-boyle
    It really is sad when a franchise is milked to death for the money. Sorry to say, but Fantastic Beasts was atrocious. I walked out of the cinema. In the case of Bond, Spectre bored me to tears as well. I can't say I have enjoyed a Bond since Casino Royale.

    Whether or not the whole genre of spy movies is tired is another question. They could do with ditching the sexism. If you want an example of a spy movie that I thought was done well, watch the 2015 Man from U.N.C.L.E.
  4. Standard membervivify
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    02 Dec '18 19:162 edits
    Salt was excellent spy movie that I highly recommend. Starring Angelina Jolie, this has none of "hot women" tropes that the posters here object to. Make sure to see the Theatrical Version NOT the "Directors Cut" or Extended Version".

    There's a recent spy movie starring Jennifer Lawrence that was absolutely atrocious. It's not a movie I'd normally watch, but there was this loudmouth at my barber shop who kept raving about it, so I gave it a go. Bad idea. It's an ugly, unpleasant movie about a female spy who seduces her targets to kill them. I don't mind sexy naked women in movies at all; but this was just grisly and offensive.

    Atomic Blonde has a female spy as the lead character, but I haven't seen that yet. I think I can guess everything this movie is about based on the title. If anyone saw this and thinks it's worth watching, let me know.
  5. Subscriberdivegeester
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    02 Dec '18 19:172 edits
    @ashiitaka said
    It really is sad when a franchise is milked to death for the money. Sorry to say, but Fantastic Beasts was atrocious. I walked out of the cinema. In the case of Bond, Spectre bored me to tears as well. I can't say I have enjoyed a Bond since Casino Royale.

    Whether or not the whole genre of spy movies is tired is another question. They could do with d ...[text shortened]... nt an example of a spy movie that I thought was done well, watch the 2015 Man from U.N.C.L.E.
    Every franchise is milked for financial gain.

    The second set of three Star Wars movies (apart from the last 45 mins of the third one) are probably the biggest disapointment in my entertainment viewing life. What was Lucas thinking! Surrounded by ‘non-gender specific “yes” persons I suspect.

    The new female Dr Who has pleasantly surprised me, partly due to Jodi Whittaker’s slightly, but not too, zany and cheekily endearing interpretation of the Dr, but also the BBC actually investing in some great stories for a change. The “Rosa” episode was superb. Production has been over-relied on for several years, but the best Dr Who episodes down the generations have always been the ones with the best stories. It is SiFi after all.

    Same with Bond imo, it’s all about the story. The Brosnon era was deeply and embarrassingly marred by an over-reliance on production and silly gimmicks. I think Craig has one more film in him before he is either too old or the franchisees succumb and turn the character into a black female gay Muslim single parent war veteran amputee. Ok, so Bond is a caricatured good-looking middle-aged white guy with a substance abuse problem, emotional attachment issues, who likes one night stands with attached women and killing people. I don’t have any issue with him.
  6. Standard memberXYYZ
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    02 Dec '18 19:42
    @vivify said
    Salt was excellent spy movie that I highly recommend. Starring Angelina Jolie,
    There is another good spy flick with a female lead but it didn't do that great at the theaters; Gina Davis is the spy with amnesia (sound familiar?), also stars Samual Jackson. Good story, the scene where she is bound to a revolving water wheel stands out.. Anybody know the name? Without using a search engine?
  7. Standard memberDeepThought
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    02 Dec '18 20:20
    @mchill

    Roger Moore was playing Bond in a Zimmer frame, I'm not convinced by your argument that he's too old.
  8. Zugzwang
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    02 Dec '18 22:291 edit
    James Bond is a male fantasy rather than anything approaching realism.
    Reportedly, the character was largely inspired by Duško Popov, a Serb double agent.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Du%C5%A1ko_Popov

    "Popov was known for his promiscuous lifestyle and courted women during his
    missions, including the French actress Simone Simon."

    "Simon never married. It was alleged by her secretary that she gave a gold key
    to her boudoir to any man she was interested in, including George Gershwin.
    However, as film historian Greg Mank reports in his audio commentary for the
    DVD of Cat People the secretary was then on trial for extorting money from her
    employer, and her word on this matter cannot be taken at face value."
    --Wikipedia
  9. Subscriberdivegeester
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    02 Dec '18 22:37
    @deepthought said
    @mchill

    Roger Moore was playing Bond in a Zimmer frame, I'm not convinced by your argument that he's too old.
    Poor old Roger; milked it to the end.

    I still enjoy The Man with the Golden Gun when it gets a Boxing Day channel 5 spin, although less for Moore and more for the charming Ekland (in her bikini) and especially for Lee who was superb as Scaramanga.
  10. Subscriberroma45
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    02 Dec '18 22:42
    @xyyz said
    There is another good spy flick with a female lead but it didn't do that great at the theaters; Gina Davis is the spy with amnesia (sound familiar?), also stars Samual Jackson. Good story, the scene where she is bound to a revolving water wheel stands out.. Anybody know the name? Without using a search engine?
    The long kiss goodnight? I think.
  11. SubscriberSuzianne
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    02 Dec '18 22:59
    @mchill said
    I was 11 when I walked to our neighborhood theatre to see the very first James Bond film, and have been a Bond fan for decades, it hurts to have to admit this, but I feel this film series is now a cold war relic that has long since become irrelevant, and the concept of the super spy saving the world with his behind the scenes maneuvers, complete with hot women, violence, and l ...[text shortened]... s://www.theguardian.com/film/2018/aug/24/james-bond-film-delayed-until-2020-daniel-craig-danny-boyle
    We've had older men playing Bond for years.

    I find it interesting that, with all the interest in the next Bond going towards Idris Elba, now suddenly people are saying the whole franchise is "too old".
  12. Subscriberdivegeester
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    02 Dec '18 23:30
    @suzianne said
    We've had older men playing Bond for years.

    I find it interesting that, with all the interest in the next Bond going towards Idris Elba, now suddenly people are saying the whole franchise is "too old".
    I don’t think the OP suggesting that the franchise is getting old has anything to do with the skin colour of the possible next protagonist.
  13. Zugzwang
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    02 Dec '18 23:37
    @deepthought said
    @mchill

    Roger Moore was playing Bond in a Zimmer frame, I'm not convinced by your argument that he's too old.
    How hard was it for Roger Moore to go from playing Simon Templar ('The Saint' ) to James Bond?
  14. Standard memberDeepThought
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    02 Dec '18 23:45
    @Duchess64

    Easier than it was for Ian Ogilvy.
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    02 Dec '18 23:47
    @divegeester said
    Poor old Roger; milked it to the end.

    I still enjoy The Man with the Golden Gun when it gets a Boxing Day channel 5 spin, although less for Moore and more for the charming Ekland (in her bikini) and especially for Lee who was superb as Scaramanga.
    Nobody had a better pose pointing a gun at a car coming straight for him than Roger.
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