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  1. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    12 Feb '19 10:29
    And there are some other fun numbers here, too:

    The number of prisoners in Switzerland has soared in the last 30 years with foreigners now accounting for 80 per cent of the prison population, according to the Swiss Federal Statistical Office.
    The study shows the rate of incarceration has gone from 72 per 100,000 residents in 1988 to 82 in 2017, Radio Télévision Suisse reports.

    During the 30-year period, Switzerland saw its prison population increase from 4,621 to 6,907, a 50 per cent increase overall.


    https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/02/08/foreigners-make-up-80-percent-of-swiss-prison-inmates/?fbclid=IwAR1DhlCIryXaSaxirrh1CJ9hGhlnElKCDZ3OcrJEHOH8Sowyt1CBQK-3CEc

    Diversity not looking that much like a strength here.
  2. Subscriberkmax87
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    12 Feb '19 12:291 edit
    @philokalia said
    And there are some other fun numbers here, too:

    [quote]The number of prisoners in Switzerland has soared in the last 30 years with foreigners now accounting for 80 per cent of the prison population, according to the Swiss Federal Statistical Office.
    The study shows the rate of incarceration has gone from 72 per 100,000 residents in 1988 to 82 in 2017, Radio Télévision ...[text shortened]... rrh1CJ9hGhlnElKCDZ3OcrJEHOH8Sowyt1CBQK-3CEc

    Diversity not looking that much like a strength here.
    Unlike the US.

    "In 1973, after 50 years of stability, the rate of incarceration in the United States began a sustained period of growth. In 1972, 161 U.S. residents were incarcerated in prisons and jails per 100,000 population; by 2007, that rate had more than quintupled to a peak of 767 per 100,000. From its high point in 2009 and 2010, the population of state and federal prisoners declined slightly in 2011 and 2012. Still, the incarceration rate, including those in jail, was 707 per 100,000 in 2012, more than four times the rate in 1972. In absolute numbers, the prison and jail population had grown to 2.23 million people, yielding a rate of incarceration that was by far the highest in the world."
    https://www.nap.edu/read/18613/chapter/4

    America must also have a diversity problem.

    But wait you have a country that has had a modest increase on the rate of incarceration 72 people per 100,000 to 82 people per 100,000 over 30 years, and to provide context, America's rate has gone from slightly more than twice the Swiss rate 161 US residents per 100,000 to 767 US residents per 100,000 over a similar time frame. An almost 10 times incease over the Swiss incarceration rate.

    I think statistics and arithmetic can be used very cleverly to produce an alarming figure, but I also think you need a greater degree of subtlety in your facile attempt at dog whistling.
  3. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    12 Feb '19 12:40
    I am glad you brought up America's diversity problem:

    "2. According to Riley, "Blacks commit violent crimes at 7 to 10 times the rate that whites do."

    Blacks committed 52 percent of homicides between 1980 and 2008, despite composing just 13 percent of the population. Across the same timeframe, whites committed 45 percent of homicides while composing 77% of the population, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics.

    Here are some more statistics from the FBI:

    In 2013, the FBI has black criminals carrying out 38 per cent of murders, compared to 31.1 per cent for whites. The offender’s race was “unknown” in 29.1 per cent of cases.

    What about violent crime more generally? FBI arrest rates are one way into this. Over the last three years of data – 2011 to 2013 – 38.5 per cent of people arrested for murder, manslaughter, rape, robbery, and aggravated assault were black."

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/7441/7-statistics-you-need-know-about-black-black-crime-aaron-bandler
  4. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    12 Feb '19 12:42
    My favorite part of it is where you say that arithmetic can be used to cleverly makeup statistics about things.

    Isn't this really just plain as day? How do you crunch the numbers funny to say that eight out of 10 inmates are foreigners? What about these numbers look like some trick was played?

    Accusing people of dog whistling by pointing out alarming statistics that matter and have a really big impact isn't proper. These are things worth talking about. If you don't believe in talking about them, just don't talk about them. If the answer is disturb you, maybe politics isn't really a thing that you should consider discuss. Don't trying to deflect adults away from having important conversations.
  5. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    12 Feb '19 13:43
    I probably came off as rude there. I apologize for that. But it always feels like every thread like this results in a lot of accusations and little real discussion -- and even when the discussion happens, it becomes rude very quickly.

    I should be more polite to you, Kmax. I am sorry.
  6. Subscriberno1marauder
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    12 Feb '19 15:002 edits
    @philokalia said
    And there are some other fun numbers here, too:

    [quote]The number of prisoners in Switzerland has soared in the last 30 years with foreigners now accounting for 80 per cent of the prison population, according to the Swiss Federal Statistical Office.
    The study shows the rate of incarceration has gone from 72 per 100,000 residents in 1988 to 82 in 2017, Radio Télévision ...[text shortened]... rrh1CJ9hGhlnElKCDZ3OcrJEHOH8Sowyt1CBQK-3CEc

    Diversity not looking that much like a strength here.
    There are two million foreigners living in Switzerland. https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/society/data_who-are-the-two-million-foreigners-living-in-switzerland/41942052

    According to the article that Breibart cited to, "The percentage of foreign prisoners residing in Switzerland represented 28% of the total (as in the first decade)," https://www.rts.ch/info/suisse/10194966-le-nombre-de-detenus-en-suisse-a-augmente-de-50-en-trente-ans.html

    So that means about 2,000 of 2 million foreign residents (or one in a thousand) are in custody.

    That doesn't really seem like such a big deal, does it? IF 999 out of 1,000 are law abiding residents of Switzerland, how is "diversity" (and Switzerland has always been "diverse" ) not a strength?
  7. Germany
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    12 Feb '19 16:33
    @philokalia said
    My favorite part of it is where you say that arithmetic can be used to cleverly makeup statistics about things.

    Isn't this really just plain as day? How do you crunch the numbers funny to say that eight out of 10 inmates are foreigners? What about these numbers look like some trick was played?

    Accusing people of dog whistling by pointing out alarming statistics that ...[text shortened]... ou should consider discuss. Don't trying to deflect adults away from having important conversations.
    Switzerland has low crime and a small prison population as a percentage of total population. What is the "alarming" thing that has "a really big impact"?
  8. Standard membershavixmir
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    12 Feb '19 18:30
    @kazetnagorra said
    Switzerland has low crime and a small prison population as a percentage of total population. What is the "alarming" thing that has "a really big impact"?
    I think the majority of Swiss crime is white. White collar, white people and they get away with blue murder.

    Other than Jewish gold and goat raping, what the hell else can you do in Switzerland?
  9. Standard memberDeepThought
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    12 Feb '19 19:36
    @shavixmir said
    I think the majority of Swiss crime is white. White collar, white people and they get away with blue murder.

    Other than Jewish gold and goat raping, what the hell else can you do in Switzerland?
    Yodelling with intent.
  10. Subscribersonhouse
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    12 Feb '19 19:44
    @shavixmir
    So the total number is under 7000 for all of Switzerland? Here in the US we have individual prisons with more than that.
  11. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    12 Feb '19 20:09
    @sonhouse said
    @shavixmir
    So the total number is under 7000 for all of Switzerland? Here in the US we have individual prisons with more than that.
    The US is a world leader in imprisoning its citizens.
  12. Subscriberno1marauder
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    12 Feb '19 20:431 edit
    @sonhouse said
    @shavixmir
    So the total number is under 7000 for all of Switzerland? Here in the US we have individual prisons with more than that.
    And 39.4% of those are pre-trial detainees, meaning they haven't yet been convicted and might never be. http://www.prisonstudies.org/country/switzerland

    Rather unsurprisingly, foreign nationals would be considered greater flight risk and thus be more likely to be denied bail or pre-trial release, thus skewing the numbers even further:

    Researchers at Bern University concluded that foreigners are seen as "flight risks" by authorities and are therefore more likely to be sent to prison than local criminals.

    https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/three-out-of-four-swiss-prisoners-are-foreign/5293728
  13. Subscriberkmax87
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    12 Feb '19 22:33
    @philokalia said
    My favorite part of it is where you say that arithmetic can be used to cleverly makeup statistics about things.

    Isn't this really just plain as day? How do you crunch the numbers funny to say that eight out of 10 inmates are foreigners? What about these numbers look like some trick was played?

    Accusing people of dog whistling by pointing out alarming statistics that ...[text shortened]... ou should consider discuss. Don't trying to deflect adults away from having important conversations.
    The thing is blacks in America are not foreigners even though they suffer systemic neglect from a system that chooses to keep them on the outside of good education, sensible investment in sustainable urban economic activity and opportunity, and not being discriminated against in the rental market due to "concerns" they may not fit in.
  14. SubscriberWajoma
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    12 Feb '19 22:36
    @kmax87 said
    Unlike the US.

    "In 1973, after 50 years of stability, the rate of incarceration in the United States began a sustained period of growth. In 1972, 161 U.S. residents were incarcerated in prisons and jails per 100,000 population; by 2007, that rate had more than quintupled to a peak of 767 per 100,000. From its high point in 2009 and 2010, the population of state and federal ...[text shortened]... ure, but I also think you need a greater degree of subtlety in your facile attempt at dog whistling.
    Summary: When there's a problem in the US all other problems in the world should be disregarded and threads discussing those problems should be diverted.
  15. SubscriberWajoma
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    12 Feb '19 22:37
    @wolfgang59 said
    The US is a world leader in imprisoning its citizens.
    Summary: When there's a problem in the US all other problems in the world should be disregarded and threads discussing those problems should be diverted.
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