Please turn on javascript in your browser to play chess.
Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 25 Oct '17 16:26
    https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=10005

    Well duh!

    Bring down math and we bring down racism!
  2. 25 Oct '17 16:37
    – FACT: Despite making up just 13% of the population, blacks commit around half of homicides in the United States. DOJ statistics show that between 1980 and 2008, blacks committed 52% of homicides, compared to 45% of homicides committed by whites.

    Do we need any other evidence that math is racist?
  3. 25 Oct '17 16:50
    Anything in particular you'd like to discuss, whodey?
  4. 25 Oct '17 17:23
    A math education professor at the University of Illinois argued in a newly published book that algebraic and geometry skills perpetuate “unearned privilege” among whites.

    Rochelle Gutierrez, a professor at the University of Illinois, made the claim in a new anthology for math teachers, arguing that teachers must be aware of the “politics that mathematics brings” in society.


    “Are we really that smart just because we do mathematics?” Tweet This


    [RELATED: EdX no longer 'teaching social justice through mathematics']

    “On many levels, mathematics itself operates as Whiteness. Who gets credit for doing and developing mathematics, who is capable in mathematics, and who is seen as part of the mathematical community is generally viewed as White,” Gutierrez argued.

    Gutierrez also worries that algebra and geometry perpetuate privilege, fretting that “curricula emphasizing terms like Pythagorean theorem and pi perpetuate a perception that mathematics was largely developed by Greeks and other Europeans."

    Math also helps actively perpetuate white privilege too, since the way our economy places a premium on math skills gives math a form of “unearned privilege” for math professors, who are disproportionately white.

    “Are we really that smart just because we do mathematics?” she asks, further wondering why math professors get more research grants than “social studies or English” professors.

    [RELATED: Prof complains about 'masculinization of mathematics']

    Further, she also worries that evaluations of math skills can perpetuate discrimination against minorities, especially if they do worse than their white counterparts.

    “If one is not viewed as mathematical, there will always be a sense of inferiority that can be summoned,” she says, adding that there are so many minorities who “have experienced microaggressions from participating in math classrooms… [where people are] judged by whether they can reason abstractly.”

    To fight this, Gutierrez encourages aspiring math teachers to develop a sense of “political conocimiento,” a Spanish phrase for “political knowledge for teaching.”

    Gutierrez stresses that all knowledge is “relational,” asserting that “Things cannot be known objectively; they must be known subjectively."
  5. 25 Oct '17 17:33
    I think Gutierrez' claims are silly and she's most likely trying to sell her book.

    Do you expect to find many people here inclined to agree with Gutierrez' line of thinking?
  6. 25 Oct '17 18:09
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    I think Gutierrez' claims are silly and she's most likely trying to sell her book.

    Do you expect to find many people here inclined to agree with Gutierrez' line of thinking?
    I would be inclined to call you a racist, only, you are a European Progressive.

    Damn it!
  7. 25 Oct '17 18:19
    Originally posted by @whodey
    I would be inclined to call you a racist, only, you are a European Progressive.

    Damn it!
    I'm not a "progressive."
  8. 25 Oct '17 18:29
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra
    I'm not a "progressive."
    Are you a deplorable regressive or an anarchist?

    Those are the only other two options, right?
  9. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    25 Oct '17 18:35
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Are you a deplorable regressive or an anarchist?

    Those are the only other two options, right?
    Don't need maths when everything is black or white.
  10. 25 Oct '17 18:41
    Originally posted by @finnegan
    Don't need maths when everything is black or white.
    Racist!

    I'm sorry, what again?
  11. 25 Oct '17 18:44 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by @kazetnagorra to Whodey
    I think Gutierrez' claims are silly and she's most likely trying to sell her book.
    Do you expect to find many people here inclined to agree with Gutierrez' line of thinking?
    "Do you expect to find many people here inclined to agree with Gutierrez' line of thinking?"
    --KazetNagorra

    Many people here (at RHP) eagerly or obstinately believe much nonsense and many falsehoods.
    In mathematics, truth is not discovered by holding a popularity contest, particularly among the ignorant.
    By the way, I know some professors of *mathematical education* who are comparatively
    poor at doing mathematics and could not qualify as professors of *mathematics*.

    The subject of mathematics is not racist. Mathematics is about the most culturally neutral subject imaginable.
    About every culture in the world has mathematical concepts, such as length, area, volume.
    About every language in the world has ways to count. Mathematics is fundamental to humanity.
    And there are no 'racially distinct' white, black, or Asian ways of doing mathematics.
    G.H. Hardy (an atheist white Englishman) could connect with Ramanujan (a devout Hindu Tamil)
    in mathematics on a deep level that they could hardly connect in any other way.

    Now some mathematical tests could (arguably) be regarded as sexist if they disproportionately assign
    weight to geometry, a subject in which females are known to do worse than males on average.
    (There's controversy over whether this is related to average differences between male and female brains.)

    Although the mainstream US media may like to act (very ignorantly or dishonestly) as though mathematics
    is dominated by white (particularly Jewish) students, in reality, that's not been true for a long time.
    For decades, the International Mathematical Olympiads have been dominated by teams from
    East Asian countries (particularly China) or Western teams of mostly students of Asian heritage.

    At the 2017 International Mathematical Olympiad, the USA was represented by a team of
    six students: 4 Chinese, 1 Indian, and only 1 white (with the fourth highest score among the six).
    At the 2017 Olympiads in mathematics, physics, chemistry, biology, and informatics, the
    USA was represented by a total of 23 students. Only one of these students is white.
    The other 22 are Asians: 17 Chinese (including two females), 4 Indians, 1 Korean.
    The USA was represented by more ethnic Chinese female students than by white students.

    In fact, recent American mathematics and science competitions have been dominated by
    students of Asian (particularly Chinese) heritage, but that's an extremely 'politically embarrassing'
    reality that the mainstream US media prefers to ignore or simply to propagate falsehoods about.

    My father used to tell me that, *compared to about everything else in life*, mathematics is fair
    and will be objectively judged (with little or no political bias). Therefore, mathematics is a
    wonderful opportunity for a disadvantaged student (whether by racism, sexism, class bias,
    or political oppression) to prove that one's more intelligent than more privileged students.
    If one has enough talent and excels in mathematics, it will be recognized eventually.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryam_Mirzakhani

    The late Maryam Mirzakhani (an Iranian) was the first woman ever to win a Fields Medal.
    She showed her potential early by winning two individual gold medals (one with a perfect score)
    at the International Mathematical Olympiads. If she had believed the stereotypical nonsense about
    everyone else supposedly being inferior to white men, then would she have become a mathematician?
  12. 25 Oct '17 19:58
    Her next target will be the alphabet. If the alphabet is required to be in a certain sequence, then the first letters discriminate against the last ones. And capital letters shouldn't be bigger than lower case letters, since that obviously shows favoritism. And why do you have to spell a word the same way every time? There's just way too much organization to it. We should each have a selfie-bet, with our own letters.